Chapter X: Part 10

"In our zeal to control the child, some have lost sight of the fact that it is quite as important to teach the child to control himself; that if he is to become a good citizen, he cannot learn too early to respect the rights of others."

At a meeting of the Massachusetts Library Club, reported in Public Libraries, v. 12, p. 362 (Nov. 1907), Miss Harriet H. Stanley of Brookline said of "Discipline in a Children's Room," that unnatural restraint was to be avoided, but the restraint required for the common good was wholesome, and that children were more, rather than less, comfortable under it, when it was exercised with judgment and in a kindly spirit.

"Judgment comes with experience. ... As far as you are able, be just. If your watchfulness fails sometimes to detect the single offender in a group of children and you must send out the group to put an end to some mischief, say so simply, and they will see that they suffer not from your hard heartedness, but from the culprit's lack of generosity or from the insufficiency of their devices for concealing him. Be philosophical. Most disturbance is only mischief and properly treated will be outgrown. Stop it promptly, but don't lose your temper, and don't get worked up. To the juvenile mind, 'getting a rise' out of you is no less exhilarating than the performance which occasions it. Habitually deny them this gratification and mischief loses its savor.

"Talk little about wrongdoing. Don't set forth to a child the error of his ways when the 'ways' are in process of being exhibited, and the exhibitor is fully conscious of their nature. Choose another time--a lucid interval--for moral suasion.

"When children are intentionally troublesome, the simplest means of discipline is exclusion from the room; when necessary, formal exclusion for a definite period with a written notice to parents. The authority of the library should be exercised in the occasional cases where it is needed, both for the wrongdoer's own good and for the sake of the example to others.

"Provided you are just and sensible and good-tempered, your patrons will respect the library more and like you none the less for exacting from them suitable behavior. We talk a good deal about the library as a place of refuge for boys and girls from careless homes, and they do deserve consideration from us, but to learn a proper regard for public law and order is as valuable as any casual benefit from books. The children of conscientious parents whether poor or well-to-do also deserve something at our hands, and we owe it to them to maintain a respectable standard of conduct for them to share. Let us be hospitable and reasonable, but let us be courageous enough to insist that the young citizen treat the library with the respect due to a municipal institution."

It has been impossible to publish in full all of the replies to the circular letter sent out, but as much as possible has been incorporated in this report, believing that each situation delineated may give helpful hints toward the solution of this general difficulty. The list of questions is given in the synopsis appended to the admirable and helpful report contributed by the chief of the children's department in Pittsburgh.

Miss Frances Jenkins Olcott, Pittsburgh

After ten years of experience we find our most difficult question of discipline arises when the older boys and girls come into the library. They usually come in the evening and we have the greatest trouble with the boys. Sometimes we suspect that our trouble with the boys is due to the influence of the girls, who know how to keep quiet and yet make confusion!

The question of discipline depends largely on the district in which a branch is placed and also on the planning and equipment of the children's room--in fact of the whole branch building, and on the personal attention of the branch librarian toward the children.

In answer to question ten I might say that everything depends on the children's librarian's judgment and also on the children. Some children come into the library to be sent home. They wish to see how many times they can make mischief, and it is really a pleasure to them to have you send them out. In other cases children are much mortified by being sent from the room. It is necessary that the children's librarian and her assistants should know the children individually, especially their names and something of their home conditions wherever possible. The handling of "gangs" takes a great deal of tact and sympathy with boys.

On the whole, given a well-planned and equipped children's room, plenty of books, a sufficient number of the right kind of children's librarians who are firm, tactful and sympathetic (having a sense of humor and a wide knowledge of children's books) and by all means a sympathetic branch librarian, the question of discipline will usually smooth itself out. We have one room in a crowded tenement district where the right young woman has produced unusual order. The children come in and go out happy and interested in their books, and there is little need for reproof. This is due largely to the fact that we started in with a determination to have reasonable order and the children learned that to use the room it was necessary to be orderly, and they are much happier and get more from the library.

SYNOPSIS

1. At what hour is the discipline most difficult?

Discipline is most difficult during the busiest time, the evening, our branch libraries being open until 9 o'clock.

2. With what ages do you have the most trouble?

The greatest trouble is with children from 10-16.

3. With boys or girls, or both?

Both boys and girls, but the greatest trouble with boys.

4. Are the scholars from the High School a special trouble?

It depends on the district in which the branch is situated and the social conditions of the people visiting the branch.

5. Do any use the library as a meeting place, or kind of club?

This also depends largely on the district.

6. Do they come in such numbers that they over-run the library and keep the older people away because of the consequent confusion, noise, and lack of room?

No, excepting under conditions produced by bad planning of buildings.

7. Do you ever ask for help in the discipline--from the trustees, police, or others?

The branches which have guards have less difficulty in discipline, otherwise in some of the crowded districts the janitors and police are occasionally called in.

8. Do the teachers help by talking to the scholars on the necessity of behavior in public places?

As far as our knowledge goes, only occasionally.

9. Have you ever addressed the schools on this topic?

No, with one exception, where it proved satisfactory.

10. Do you ever send unruly children (either older or younger ones) home? If so, with what result in the case of the individual? With what effect on the whole problem? For how long do you suspend a child? What are the terms on which he can return?

(a) We always send unruly children home, procuring their name and address first whenever possible. If we have to send the same child from the room frequently, a letter is sent to the parent stating the reason. (b) This has worked well with but three exceptions in four years. The crucial point is to find the name of the child. (c) We have never suspended a child for more than two months unless he were arrested for misbehavior. (d) An apology to the librarian and good behavior following. (Hazelwood)

We send children from the library.

In this district we have two classes of disorderly children. Those who came from homes where they have had no restraint of any sort, and have too recently come to the library to have acquired reading-room manners; and those who know very well how to conduct themselves, but enjoy making a disturbance. We do our best to help the former to learn how to conduct themselves quietly--the essential means of course is to interest them in books and to make them feel the friendliness of the room. But when a child of the second class is disorderly, he is first made to sit quite by himself; if he is persistently noisy, he is sent from the room. The length of time he is suspended depends on his previous conduct and on the offense in question; from a day to a month or more. A child usually behaves like an angel when he first comes back after being out of the library for any length of time.

We have a good many restless children, especially in winter, whom it is difficult to interest in reading, but who enjoy pictures. And we have found it useful to have plenty of copies of especially interesting numbers of illustrated magazines like Outing and World's Work to give them. And we have a desk list of especially interesting illustrated books that we find useful for these children. (East Liberty)

Mr. Walter L. Brown, Buffalo, N. Y.

Our work, even in the branches, does not offer much suggestion so far as library discipline is concerned. I have talked the matter over with all those having charge of the branches, the work with the children in the main library, and the depositories at the settlement houses, and they all agree, without hesitation, that they are having no trouble whatever with the children of any size.

The William Ives Branch, which is in the district occupied by the Polish and German people, had some trouble when it occupied a store opening on the street. For a few weeks after this branch was opened, the rough boys in the neighborhood bothered by shouting, throwing things in the doors, and forming in large crowds around the front of the building. The police helped out by giving us a guard for a brief period. As soon as the novelty of the library had worn off, and the children began actually to use the books and get acquainted with the attendants, all trouble seemed to stop.

We also had some trouble at one of the depositories when it was first opened, this being in a rather unruly district in the lower part of the city. All is now quiet here, and has been for a number of years.

The consensus of opinion of our staff seems to be that when any slight disturbance, which is all that we ever have now, occurs that it is caused by one, two, or three boys. The problem of preventing its repetition is solved by recognizing these boys, and when matters are quiet, having a talk with them, gaining their confidence and friendship. This, of course, is after any punishment is administered. This has been done in a number of instances, and has always been successful. Some of the library's best friends among the older boys have been gained in this way.

The only discipline that is exerted is by sending the children away from the library, and if they are told that they must stay away for two or three days or a week, this is final and they are not allowed to return until the time has expired. If a child is using the Library, this seems to be all the punishment that is necessary.

We should say that in a library where there is any continued trouble with the young people, it is not their fault, but the fault of the library, and we should solve it by changing the library methods.

Miss Clara F. Baldwin, Minnesota.

Of course we all know that almost everything depends on the personality of the librarian, and it has been my observation that the librarians of strong, winning personality, who make friends with the children and young people from the start, have little trouble with discipline. Your question relating to the co-operation with the teachers seems to me very pertinent. In some cases where discipline in the schools is not properly maintained, there has been corresponding difficulty in the library. Does it not all come back to personality, tact, and strength of character, just as every problem of success or failure does?

My theory is that order must be maintained even if the police have to be called in, but do not drive the offenders away from the library if you can possibly help it. They are probably just the ones who need it most. Sometimes it may mean personal visits to the parents, but I wouldn't lose a boy or girl if I could possibly hang on to them.

Mr. George F. Bowerman, Washington, D. C.

We have your circular letter inquiring about the discipline in our library as related to school children. In general I would say that we have very little trouble in this direction. Most of the trouble we have comes from the colored element which forms about one-third of the population.

We are striving to get Congress, from which all our appropriations come, to give us a regular police officer. I am a great believer in the moral influence of brass buttons. At the present time, our engineer and fireman are both sworn as special police officers. They both have police badges, which they can display on occasions. I would, however, like to have a regular officer in uniform.

Miss Isabel Ely Lord, Pratt Institute, Brooklyn.

The difficulties of discipline in this library arise almost entirely from the nature of the building, as the chief disturbance with us is the noise of laughing and talking in the halls. This is done quite innocently because people do not realize that the big hall, with its beautiful stairway is really a part of the building and that noise made there echoes through into the various departments. The children have to cross a wide stretch of intarsia floor, and any natural, normal child is seized with a desire to run. For this reason we have the janitor stationed in the lower hall from twelve to one and three to six each day. When he is there, there is very little difficulty.

In the library rooms we do not have the trouble that occurs in a community where the constituents of the Library know each other well. In a big, shifting population like ours, people meet usually strangers and there is no temptation to disturbing conversation or to flirtation

In the children's room, as indeed in the adult department, the matter is almost entirely controlled by personal knowledge of people who offend. A child is spoken to by name and is made to realize that it is a distinct individual matter if he or she has offended. There have been occasions in the children's room when a crowd of the older boys has come in, with evident intention of making a little disturbance. Miss Moore established the custom, in such cases, of asking each of these boys to sign his name and address to a slip--or a separate sheet of paper-- and this had usually a sufficiently quieting effect to obviate the need of anything further. Occasionally the children's librarian has gone to visit a child's parents, and so has the librarian. We also have asked some times fathers and mothers to come to the library to "hold court," but this has been in cases of theft and suspected theft, and I suppose you do not include that in your questions of discipline.

We lay great stress, especially in the Children's Room, on the importance of a perfectly quiet and controlled manner in the assistants. The training that our children have received in the Story Hour, we feel, to be very valuable to them. This is a special privilege to which they are admitted and they recognize it as such. They have learned to come in and to go out on Story Hour evenings with as much quietness as one can expect from a body of children, and they are very courteous in the Story Hours, saying a quiet "Thank you" to the story-teller instead of indulging in clapping of hands, stamping of feet, etc. These things help, I think, in the general control of the room, and I think that Miss Cowing (who is not here now to speak for herself) has occasionaly disciplined some child by refusing a Story Hour ticket because of misbehavior in the room.

Mr. A. L. Peck, Gloversville, N. Y.

This institution has been in existence over twenty-eight years and during all this time, there has been no trouble with discipline. I am not willing to say that our young people or even our older ones, are better than those of other places, but from the very beginning everybody was given to understand that they had to live up to a certain decorum, that is, men and boys have to take off their hats and disturbing conversation is not permitted.

While we do not hesitate to speak to any who need reminding that reading rooms are for serious purposes, in all these years we have sent out of the rooms, three adults and five boys. Our janitor is sworn in as a special policeman and everybody knows that not only prompt ejection from the room, but also discipline before the recorder in the city courts would be forthcoming in consequence of any serious breach of order.

I have never hesitated to make it known that the readers' rights must be respected and that reading and studying is serious work and our people have always supported me in this, fully as much as the board of directors. I do believe that as soon as people understand this, there will be no trouble, but there must be no vacillating policy.

The trouble we have occasionally with boys, mainly, is that they try to be smart and will deliberately put books on the shelves bottom side up, but one of the youngsters was caught in the act and promptly sent home. His father was notified and fully agreed with us that the library was no place for such mischief and promised that his youngster would behave henceforth. This had a wholesome effect on all the others and there has been no trouble since.

I also have to say that our children's room is 45 feet away from the adult department and we do not permit young people under 14 to roam about the building, we keep them strictly in their own room. As soon as young people are admitted to the high school, we at once admit them to the entire library even if they should be under 14 years of age. They consider this a great privilege and we thus far have had no trouble. The high school students come here for study as well as for reference work and make proper use of the library. They know from experience that we do not allow any nonsense and under no consideration would we permit the library to be a place of rendezvous for promiscuous visiting.

Our institution seems to discipline itself without any difficulty. The principle upon which we work is very simple. "Readers demand quiet, therefore, conversation even in low tones, is strictly prohibited." This is literally carried out and not the least exception is made. Posters, with the rule quoted above printed on small cards are distributed through the rooms, placed on the tables and renewed from time to time.

As soon as the public realizes that it is the intention of the Board of Managers and their representative officers to live up strictly to this rule and to carry it out at all hazards, they soon learn to behave and not much difficulty is experienced.

Mr. A. L. Bailey, Wilmington, Del.

The discipline in this library while occasionally bothersome, does not on the whole cause us much annoyance. The offenders are chiefly students from the high school who use the library in the afternoon and forget at times that the reading room is a place of quiet. No special measures have been taken to preserve quiet. Generally once speaking to the offender will prove sufficient to stop whispering or loud conversation, but if he is persistent in talking or whispering, we request that he leave the room. This always has a good effect, for its seldom happens that we have to expel the same person more than once. In asking readers to leave the reading room, we realize that we run the risk of making them so angry that they will never again make use of the library but we believe that the great majority who are quiet and well-behaved shall not be annoyed if we can prevent it.

While the older children from the schools are the chief offenders, perhaps the most exasperating are the influential women of the city who come to the library on market days (Wednesday and Saturday mornings) and visit more or less with each other. This is a custom established long before the library became free, and owing to the prominence of the offenders and their real interest in and intelligent use of the library, one with which it is hard to deal. A sign placed in the reading room requesting readers to refrain from all unnecessary conversation has had a most noticeable effect on this class of readers and the annoyance is much less than it was three years ago.

The juvenile department occasionally has to call upon a policeman to help keep order. This, however, is due to the fact that there is a large hallway and broad stairways just outside the rooms which the library occupies. Discipline in this part of the building is a cause of great annoyance. We cannot afford to pay a guard to stay in the hall and as the police force is not sufficient for the city's needs, a policeman can only spend a few moments as he passes by on his beat. In the juvenile room itself we have trouble only with gangs of young negroes and this only occasionally. When they come to the library it is hard to interest them and the demoralizing influence that they introduce compels us at times to expel them and even to forbid them to return. We have only once sent special word to the schools asking teachers to request children to preserve order. We believe that the teachers, so far as they are able, try to inculcate principles of right behavior in public places, but we believe that the discipline of this library is entirely in our own hands, and until the situation becomes one with which we can not cope, we prefer not to call upon the schools for assistance.

Miss Caroline M. Underhill, Utica, N. Y.

One of the problems in guiding these intermediate readers does not pertain to their reading, but to controlling the lawlessness which is frequently manifested. General restlessness, a desire for fun always and everywhere, characterizes many of the young people who frequent our libraries. A difference in locality brings different problems, but this one is universal. In Utica our new building brought increased opportunity to those inclined to fun. The strangeness of it, access to the stack, curiosity concerning the glass floors, the book-lift, the elevator, and even the electric lights, with the constant moving about of people who came simply to see the building, increased this tendency to restlessness among the young readers. In addition to this came the everpresent problem of the flirtatious boy and girl. Our wish to let them enjoy all possible liberty was soon interpreted to mean license.

Finding that they did not yield to ordinary methods, it was decided, as an emergency measure, to issue "stack cards" through the second year in High School. These were small cards having Utica Public Library printed at the top: then space for name and address, followed by "is hereby granted the privilege of using the stack for reading and study." These gave permission to use the stacks for selecting books and for reading at the stack tables.

Before issuing these cards, each boy and girl was instructed as to the right use of a library and the consideration due from one reader to another, and then asked to sign a register in which they promised to use the library properly whenever they came. These cards were to be shown each time they wished to go into the stacks, but in no way did they interfere with drawing books at the desk, if they had neglected to bring them. Any mis-behavior took away this stack card until they were again ready to fulfill their promise.

This plan was entirely foreign to our theories, our wishes, or our beliefs, but in an emergency proved helpful in making the boys and girls realize we were in EARNEST when we said we wished to have it more quiet. Best of all, it gave an opportunity for a little personal talk with each one, and though of necessity this took much time, we considered it well worth while. Decided improvement made it unnecessary to continue the use of the card.

To the older boys and girls we take pains to explain why we ask them to respect the place and the rights of others. Occasionally we have written a letter to those who offend continually, signed by the librarian and a member of the library committee. In the majority of cases this brought about the needed reform-- if not, the privileges of the library were taken away.

Miss Mary A. Smith, Eau Claire, Wis.

I am quite interested in your questions about discipline, as we feel we have reached a very comfortable stage in the problem after considerable agitation and I have wondered some times what plan others followed.

Our whole argument with young people--(that means high school here as they seemed the only disturbing element) was consideration for other people. When talking to grade pupils that were soon to come into high school, we explained that we could have only two grades in a public library, children and grown people. When they entered high school and used the main library almost entirely, we classed them as grown people and must expect from them the same carefulness, as older people were much more easily disturbed.

The discipline we found, as usually is the case, one of individuals. We first spoke to the transgressor. If he did not pay sufficient regard as shown in action, we suspended him usually for a week, with a very definite explanation, that before he returned, he must give a pledge in place of the one on the registration card which he had broken. He knew these pledges were filed away as part of the library record. If that pledge was broken it meant that the case would be referred to the Library Board. This had to be done but once and that had an excellent effect. The Board suspended for several months with the understanding that return then depended on pledges made to the librarian.

There must be one person who is making the standard for conduct and that person must be on hand during hours when trouble is likely to arise; that means the librarian. Assistants must be in sympathy, watch, help and report cases, but not take active part in discipline.

The penalty must be a very certain thing, as sure a law in the public library as violation of law on the streets. There must not be nagging of young people nor wasting of words. When a transgressor is told to do anything, it must be done in such a manner, and without anger or annoyance in voice, if possible, so that a librarian can turn away and know the order will be obeyed.

I believe it is possible to establish a standard of conduct in a public library, which a young person will feel and know if he is not within that standard. It can not be done in a week nor a month. I hope we have one here now. I mean by that also that a librarian can leave the library and not feel that any advantage is going to be taken of an assistant because she is not there. I do not believe in a librarian popping in any time during her off hours making the young people feel she is ready to spring upon them at unexpected moments.

The above states what we have been doing, and we seldom now have to think of discipline. If we see signs of carelessness, we nip them in the bud. One must discriminate between a moment's thoughtlessness in a young person and the beginning of a wrong library habit. That may not seem clearly put. A firm, steady glance in his direction and the way he takes it will usually diagnose the case.

I think the object of discipline in a Public Library is much more than to keep young people quiet. It seems now-a-days one of the few public places where they may mingle with older people and show them consideration. A quiet library ought to be an antidote for unseasonable boisterousness suffered by young people. No librarian need fear she is driving people away, if she tightens up all along this line. That at least has not been our experience, as we grew rapidly while we were the most strenuous. People have more respect for an institution, where each person will be held to his privileges, and not be allowed to interfere with another's.

I was amused the other night when a high school boy, who had needed suggestion himself two years ago, came to me and said he thought two younger boys were disturbing an older gentleman in the reference room. These younger boys who were only talking more than was necessary, had not used the reference room and did not clearly understand that the same amount of conversation was not allowed there as in the other room. I spoke to them and when I returned suggested to the older boy that he might keep an eye on them, as I much preferred they stay there and think of the older man than come into the other room. He reported that they gave no more trouble.

Our reference room discipline has been very much assisted by a signing of the simple agreement: "I promise to refrain from all unnecessary conversation in the reference room." All high school students sign before using the room. The paper lies on the loan desk so at a glance we expect to be able to tell who is there. The room is away from the desk and can not be watched from it. "Unnecessary" was not in when we began. It was absolute, but we found we could give more liberty. Whenever this pledge was violated, which was not often even at first, no explanation was accepted, a word had been broken: "A bad thing," we said, "for a young person in a public library. Don't sign what you cannot keep."

One must be even and not allow one day what one lets pass the next and that is not an easy thing to do. Do not start to evolve an orderly library out of a disorderly one and expect to escape all criticism. Be ready to explain fully to the parent whose child has been disciplined.

I have wondered sometimes if the disorderly library did not have more than one cause. If you wish orderly conduct you must also have an orderly library, a place for everything and everything in its place. We have not a perfect library yet in Eau Claire and we hope we may obtain some suggestions from other libraries to help on that glad time.

Miss Harriet A. Wood, Cedar Rapids, Iowa.

The difficulty can be largely overcome by giving the active boys something to do. We let them put up books and even slip the books, if they are careful, put in labels, etc. We have a Boy's Club recently organized. Now the girls are clamoring for one. A trustee has charge of it. I believe that the librarian should make more of an effort to know the boys and girls personally. During the past two months, we have been working along this line with good results. The boys are simply full of spirit; they are not bad. We never ought to expect to eliminate noise entirely, unless we drive out the children. Our library is open without partitions between the children's room and the other rooms. Boys that have been troublesome in the past, come in now that they are older, and read like gentlemen. Many of the boys, we find upon inquiry, are orphans. some without fathers, some without mothers. The probation officer of the Juvenile court works with us. One of her boys is an ardent helper in the children's room. We have found it much better to speak to a boy quietly when he is not with his companions. He is more likely to respond. We try to make the boys and girls feel that we are interested in them. If they come to us to use the library as a meeting and perhaps a loafing place, we should be glad. If we have not the time and strength to seize this opportunity for social betterment, we should enlist tactful men and women in the city who can help with the problem.

Miss Mary A. Smith, La Crosse, Wis.

At the branch, the discipline is the great difficulty. The branch took the place of a badly managed boy's club so we really did not have a fair start. The discipline in the room is still a problem not entirely solved. A large number of the most restless boys had no respect for authority and had the impression that the library, being a free and public institution, was a place where they could act as they pleased. Through the kindness of Mr. Austin and Mr. Hiller, who have given their time to read aloud to the boys two evenings a week and have personally interested the boys in the books at the library, this impression has changed and in its place has come an attempt on the part of some of the boys at a system of self government. Next fall we hope to establish clubs among the boys, giving them the use of the room back of the reading room and any assistance they may need, but leaving the organization in their hands.

The reading aloud has been most successful and has had a constant attendance of about 50 boys. With the children lies our chief hope of developing the reading habit and love of good books. Through the children also we look for the increase in adult readers. This grows slowly at the branch for the reason that older people do not yet come to read the magazines kept on file in the room.

Mr. Henry J. Carr, Scranton, Pa.

To send unruly children out of the building and forbid them to come again until prepared to behave properly is our strongest "card," and it proves effective, too. No definite period is assigned.

Administration of all discipline promptly, pleasantly, but no less firmly and without relaxation, on the least sign of its need, we find to do much towards obviating the necessity.

Miss Maude Van Buren, Mankato, Minn.

I make occasional visits to all the schools, and the first talk of the year usually includes a word on conduct, but I am careful to have the young people feel that I know their shortcomings in this matter are only those of thoughtlessness, never of mischief nor meanness; that the only reason for requiring perfect quiet in a public library is a consideration of other's rights. It is all a matter of the librarian's attitude.

Miss Grace D. Rose, Davenport, Iowa.

When the children's room was in the basement in a room much too small for the numbers which came, there was a great deal of noise and confusion. Since the removal to the large, beautiful room on the second floor, the order has been much improved. The children seem impressed by the dignity and quiet of the room, and even upon days when they come in large numbers, there is no confusion and very little of the former playing.

At present, we have several children who are allowed to draw books but must transact their business as quickly as possible, and cannot exchange them under two weeks.

Miss Ethel F. McCullough, Superior, Wis.

The question of library discipline is not so much a question of troublesome and disorderly patrons, as it is a question of library administration. Given a quiet, attentive staff, a building arranged for complete supervision, noiseless floors and furniture intelligently placed--given these five essentials, a well ordered library must be the inevitable result. With any one of these lacking, the problem of discipline becomes a complicated one.

Mrs. Grace K. Hairland, Marshalltown, Iowa.

The matter of discipline, in a small public library, where the loan desk with its unavoidable attendant confusion, is so near the Reading Room as to furnish a cover for the whispering and fun--is not the easiest problem in the world to solve. There is nothing we desire more than to have every man, woman, and child love the library. To wet blanket the enthusiasm with which they seek our sanctuary the instant school is over, surely would not be good administration. The majority come to do serious work; it is only a few who use it as a trysting place and who disturb the "Absolute silence" which we profess to maintain, (and of which we have tangible reminders conspicuously posted) and yet we realize that those few irrepressibles may prove most annoying to serious readers. Tact is necessary and methods must be devised to correct this without using so much severity or nagging, as to drive away the thoughtless. Often we have arranged to do some reference work, looking up material for club programs perhaps, at the hour just after school when the older children flock into the reading room. This can be done at the tables and "sitting in their midst" has a salutary effect. Of course it could not be done with a staff of one or two.

During this last winter the high school arranged for seven debates. The unbounded enthusiasm of those taking part resulted in a total ignoring of the rules; groups of debaters stood about hotly contesting points, causing consternation to the staff until the plan of giving over to them the newspaper room, (not used by the public) was carried into effect. Every effort is made to keep the good will of the older boys and girls, and it is only with these that there is any suggestion of trouble. The children's room, especially since we have had a children's librarian, is under perfect discipline. There are dissected maps, quiet games, and stereopticon views on their tables beside Caldecott's and other picture books and they are so well entertained that there is no occasion for mischief.

Extreme measures are not resorted to among the older boys and girls except on rare occasions. If, after being spoken to once or twice and perhaps sent out, they still prove obstreperous, they are suspended for a month and this has always resulted in reform.

In no case have we found it necessary to resort to aid from the police. I should like very much to have a club room, or "conversation room" perhaps it might be called. The shelves of the newspaper room are filled with magazines for binding and these are often misplaced and even torn and lost when that room is used; besides it is in the basement and out of sight. The ideal room would have glass doors and the occupants in sight of the staff all the time. Then the high school students could come from the strict discipline and restraint of the school room and have a quiet discussion of their work or even a social chat and be in a much better place than the cigar stores or post office.

Miss Grace Blanchard, Concord, N. H.

When a librarian is much "dressed up" and can take time to play that she is an agreeable hostess, all children, whether little aristocrats or arabs, enter into the civilized spirit of the occasion and become more mannerly.

Miss Lucy Lee Pleasants, Menasha, Wis.

To achieve the best results, the librarian should never make an enemy and should lose no opportunity of making a friend. If children talk at the tables, separate them by asking them politely to change their seats. If they have really something to talk over, such as a lesson or a sleighride, permit them to go into another room to discuss it. They will appreciate the privilege and will behave better in consequence.

I have known a gang of little boys, who had the habit of coming to the reading room to make a disturbance, completely won over and converted into agreeable patrons by being captured red handed and told an amusing story. Children who come to the library are like everybody else--very apt to treat you as you treat them.

Mrs. C. P. Barnes, Kenosha, Wis.

About a year ago, I submitted a rule to the Board for their approval, and asked permission to have it printed on cards, for use on the tables in the reading room. It was worded as follows:-- "A rule has been made that no whispering nor talking shall be allowed in the reading room, even for purposes of study. For the good of the public, this rule will be strictly enforced, and anyone failing to observe it will be requested to leave the building. By order of the Board of Directors." It has been more effective in promoting order than any other experiment. Of course it occasionally happens that the card is overlooked or unheeded, but it is a very simple matter to hand one of these cards to the offender, and with a pleasant smile say, "We have no choice but to enforce this rule" and the deed is done.

Miss Helen L. Price, Merrill, Wis.

When we know our young scamp and always speak to him in a spirit of good fellowship when we meet him, and take an opportunity in the library some time when there is no one to be disturbed, to discuss postage stamps, chickens, rabbits, or, best of all, dogs with him, he will soon lose all desire to torment, and when it is only exuberance to contend with, then that is easy.

For malicious disturbance, we send the offender out, quickly and surely and discuss the matter with him later, if at all. "Go-- quickly and quietly--and no noise outside if you want to come back."

Miss Agnes Dwight, Appleton, Wis.

We do not have absolute quiet all the time and I do not aim to have, but it is a favorite place for all ages to come. I, myself, never tell a boy that if I have to speak to him again I shall send him out. He goes the first time if it is necessary to speak to him at all. That sounds savage, but it is a long time since I have had to be so cruel. We have the goodwill of the small boy, that is for the time being, they may begin to act up at any time.

Mrs. W. G. Clough, Portage, Wis.

Judging from the impression made upon people from other libraries I should infer that our library is in a pretty well ordered condition in the matter of discipline.

From the opening of our library we have impressed upon the public the necessity for quiet and order. We do not permit any talking aloud, a rule to which there are very few exceptions. The use, even, of subdued tones in the routine of selecting and exchanging books is not allowed among children and is discouraged among adults. The public understand and appreciate the fact that the library is no place for visitation or conversation. It has been necessary to pursue this course as we have but one large room for stacks, reference books, reading tables, children's department and charging desk.

We have in a measure to contend against the noise attendant upon hard wood floors, and we are disturbed at times during the last hour of the evening from the room above which is the armory of the city company of the national guard. This, however, in no way affects the discipline of the library, excepting as it makes discipline there more essential.

Miss Deborah B. Martin, Green Bay, Wis.

Occasionally we have had difficulty from a crowd of boys entering the room in a body with a great deal of noise, annoying the librarian and readers by making a disturbance at the tables and altogether proving themselves a nuisance. We found that the most effective means for putting a decisive stop to the trouble was to write a polite note to the parents of each offender, saying that as the boy was proving an annoyance to library patrons, it might be well if he was kept away from the library until he was old enough to understand its uses. The parents have never resented this notice and after a reasonable time, the youth has returned to the library chastened and pleasant and there has been no further trouble with him.

High school boys and girls do make the library a meeting place, and two years ago it became so noticeable that the Principal of one of the high schools, in a communication to the parents of scholars, spoke of the public library as a rendezvous. It is certainly not the province of the librarian unless these young people prove an annoyance to the reader, to discipline them or tell them what company they should keep. At a meeting of the Woman's club, the librarian was asked to speak to the club on the Public Library and its Work. This gave an opportunity to bring in the question of library discipline in its relation to the young people who flocked there less for study than for pleasure. The talk in this instance fortunately reached the right people, who perhaps had never thought the matter over before, and the library is not now, to any extent, used as a meeting place for high school students, although they still use it largely in their reference work.

Miss Nannie W. Jayne, Alexandria, Ind.

A few boys and girls from the high school and eighth grade have made two or three attempts to use the library as a meeting place. These meetings have been promptly broken up and a private talk with each offender has been the means used to prevent a repetition of the offense. A special effort has been made to impress the girls with correct ideas on this point, and in almost every case, these talks have resulted in an apology from the girl for her behavior.

If all general conversation be prohibited, the library offers but little attraction to those who would come merely for a good time.

Miss Martha E. Dunn, Stanley, Wis.

We have had some experience with the older scholars making the library a meeting place. I mentioned the fact to the library board, and the president, who was the editor of our local paper at that time, made mention of it in the next issue. Since then, there has been no trouble. Our local paper has done much toward helping to put down any annoyance in and around the library building. It is a good thing to have the editor of the paper on the library board.

Miss Anna S. Pinkum, Marinette, Wis.

Our problems of discipline are, in some respects, peculiar to local conditions and in other respects, are the results of a larger movement which seems to be sweeping the entire country. Broadly speaking, two causes which make discipline such a difficult task stand out prominently:

1. Local causes. A 9 o'clock curfew law and that not enforced; parents allowing their children to roam the streets at night; misdemeanors winked at by those in authority, particularly the police; a general laxity on the part of parents and city officials in correcting offences.

2. Universal movement. Loss of parental authority. This is not peculiar to Marinette, but it is a deplorable state of affairs which is being brought to light all over the country.

We find that moral suasion does not work effectively. Theoretically probably none of us believes in being caught wearing a frown, but most of our boys and girls respect sternness and assertive authority when they will not respond to any sort of kindly advice or appeal to their better natures.

After the study of this problem for some time, the conclusion reached is this:--With one assistant, we can control any situation that may present itself within the library and by so doing, in time, may create the habit of quiet and orderly conduct; but until parents realize that their children need guidance, correction, and above all need to be kept from roaming the streets at night, the problem of discipline will be an ever present one both in the schools and in the library at Marinette.

Mrs. Anna C. Bronsky, Chippewa Falls, Wis.

We have had only a few occasions when it was necessary to deny pupils the privileges of the library. In such cases, the suspended one may come to the library for any books needed in school work, but is not allowed to remain longer than is necessary and may not go in to the reading room. This has been found helpful in most cases. I dislike very much to send a child out of the library, and only do so when it is imperative; for while they may be trying at times, they are the very ones who need the help that the library can give. Often the mischievous mood is of short duration, the attention is arrested by something in one of the books before him, and suddenly, your noisy boy is transformed into a studious youth. It is a great satisfaction to know that while the small child is in the library, he is not only safe from the evil influences of the street but is deriving a double benefit--the enjoyment of the book that absorbs him for the time being, and the habit of reading that is unconsciously being formed.

Mr. R. Oberholzer, Sioux City, Iowa.

If a real disturbance is made which seems clearly intentional, a quick dismissal follows. Reproof is never repeated--once speaking in that way is enough. Reproof is always made in an undertone, and the command to go home, while imperative, is in a few words and followed by absolute silence until obeyed. This is much more impressive than any amount of talk. Dismissal is only for the day. I have never suspended anyone, and only once did I write to the lad's mother that it would be better if her son did not come to the library for a time. If a child really wants to come to the library he learns to conduct himself so as not to offend the people who are in other ways such good friends of his. If he only comes for mischief, he soon concludes that the game is not worth the candle. The desire to "show off," always a strong element in a mischievous child, is not gratified, and the whole atmosphere is against him.

To keep things going in this way is not easy except by eternal vigilance, both for the public who have to be taught some things over every day, and for library workers who have to learn to be good natured but unyielding, obliging but arbitrary, eternally patient but abnormally quick.

In short, discipline in a library is, as everywhere, a matter of atmosphere rather than method, and atmosphere always means a group of forces expressed through personality.

Miss Nelle A. Olson, Moorhead, Minn.

Before our library opened, I visited all the rooms of all the schools of the city to talk library. I tried to awaken interest and enthusiasm, and to make perfectly clear to the students beforehand the purpose of a library and what was expected of them there and why.

During the first few weeks I managed to spend a good deal of time in their room, moving about among them, helping them, and ready with a word of reminder the very moment a boy forgot himself. I tried in every possible way to help them to form correct library habits from the first. They all seemed anxious to conform to the library spirit when they understood it.

Now, when a boy does something a little out of the way, I try to pass over it as much as possible at the time, then when he comes in again some time, perhaps having forgotten his feeling of irritation, I try to talk kindly with him about it and I find he usually takes it kindly then, and does not trouble again.

I have tried always to take it for granted that the boy did not mean to annoy but forgot himself or was a little careless. I have no set procedure, but try to settle each little difficulty as that particular case seems to warrant and never to let it go on until it becomes a great one.

Miss Kate M. Potter, Baraboo, Wis.