Chapter M: CAMPBELL then rose and spoke as follows (7)

This being the day appointed by law for the meeting of the present Session, the following members of the House of Representatives appeared and took their seats, to wit:

_From New Hampshire_--Silas Betton, Clifton Claggett, David
Hough, and Samuel Tenney.

_From Massachusetts_--Jacob Crowninshield, Thomas Dwight, Nahum
Mitchell, Ebenezer Seaver, William Stedman, Joseph B. Varnum,
and Lemuel Williams.

_From Rhode Island_--Nehemiah Knight and Joseph Stanton.

_From Connecticut_--John Davenport and John Cotton Smith.

_From Vermont_--William Chamberlin, Martin Chittenden, James
Elliot, and Gideon Olin.

_From New York_--Gaylord Griswold, Josiah Hasbrouck, Henry
W. Livingston, Andrew McCord, Samuel L. Mitchill, Beriah
Palmer, Erastus Root, Thomas Sammons, David Thomas, Philip Van
Cortlandt, Killian K. Van Rensselaer, and Daniel C. Verplanck.

_From New Jersey_--Adam Boyd, Ebenezer Elmer, James Sloan, and
Henry Southard.

_From Pennsylvania_--Isaac Anderson, David Bard, Joseph Clay,
Frederick Conrad, William Findlay, Joseph Heister, Michael
Leib, John Rea, Jacob Richards, John Smilie, John Stewart, and
John Whitehill.

_From Maryland_--John Archer, Wm. McCreery, Nicholas R. Moore,
and Thomas Plater.

_From Virginia_--Thomas Claiborne, John Dawson, John W. Eppes,
Thomas Griffin, David Holmes, John G. Jackson, Joseph Lewis,
jun., Anthony New, Thomas Newton, jun., John Randolph, Thomas
M. Randolph, John Smith, James Stephenson, and Philip R.
Thompson.

_From Kentucky_--George Michael Bedinger, John Boyle, and
Thomas Sanford.

_From North Carolina_--Willis Alston, jun., William Blackledge,
James Gillespie, James Holland, William Kennedy, Nathaniel
Macon, (Speaker,) Richard Stanford, and Joseph Winston.

_From Tennessee_--George W. Campbell, William Dickson, and John
Rhea.

_From South Carolina_--John B. Earle.

_From Georgia_--Peter Early and David Meriwether.

_From Ohio_--Jeremiah Morrow.

_Delegate from the Mississippi Territory_--William Lattimore.

Several new members, to wit: from Massachusetts, SIMON LARNED, returned to serve in this House as a member for the said State, in the room of TOMPSON J. SKINNER, who has resigned his seat; from New York, SAMUEL RIKER, returned to serve as a member for the said State, in the room of JOHN SMITH, appointed a Senator of the United States; and from Virginia, CHRISTOPHER CLARK, returned to serve as a member for the said State, in the room of JOHN TRIGG, deceased; appeared, produced their credentials, and took their seats in the House; the oath to support the Constitution of the United States being first administered to them by Mr. SPEAKER, according to law.

And a quorum, consisting of a majority of the whole number, being present,

_Ordered_, That a message be sent to the Senate, to inform them that a quorum of this House is assembled, and ready to proceed to business; and that the Clerk of this House do go with the said message.

The following committees were appointed pursuant to the standing rules and orders of the House, viz:

_Committee of Elections._--Mr. FINDLAY, Mr. VARNUM, Mr. LIVINGSTON, Mr. KENNEDY, Mr. EPPES, Mr. CLAGGETT, and Mr. ELMER.

_Committee of Ways and Means._--Mr. JOHN RANDOLPH, Mr. JOSEPH CLAY, Mr. GAYLORD GRISWOLD, Mr. BOYLE, Mr. DAVENPORT, Mr. NICHOLAS R. MOORE, and Mr. MERIWETHER.

_Committee of Commerce and Manufactures._--Mr. SAMUEL L. MITCHILL, Mr. CROWNINSHIELD, Mr. MCCREERY, Mr. LEIB, Mr. NEWTON, Mr. EARLY, and Mr. CHITTENDEN.

_Committee of Claims._--Mr. JOHN COTTON SMITH, Mr. HOLMES, Mr. PLATER, Mr. CHAMBERLIN, Mr. Bedinger, Mr. STANFORD, and Mr. STANTON.

_Committee of Revisal and Unfinished Business._--Mr. TENNEY, Mr. DICKSON, and Mr. EARLE.

The SPEAKER laid before the House a letter from the Governor of the State of Maryland, enclosing a certificate of the election of ROGER NELSON, to serve in this House as a member for the said State, in the room of DANIEL HEISTER, deceased; which was referred to the Committee of Elections.

TUESDAY, November 6.

Several other members, to wit: from Massachusetts, MANASSEH CUTLER; from Connecticut, SAMUEL W. DANA and ROGER GRISWOLD; from New Jersey, JAMES MOTT; from Pennsylvania, JOHN A. HANNA, JOHN B. C. LUCAS, and ISAAC VAN HORNE; from Maryland, JOHN CAMPBELL; from Virginia, JOHN CLOPTON; and from South Carolina, THOMAS LOWNDES, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

Another new member, to wit: ROGER NELSON, from Maryland, returned to serve in this House as a member for the said State, in the room of DANIEL HEISTER, deceased, appeared, produced his credentials, was qualified, and took his seat in the House.

Mr. J. RANDOLPH moved for the appointment of a committee on the part of the House to join a committee of the Senate to wait on the PRESIDENT and inform him that a quorum of both Houses is formed, and ready to receive his communications.

Mr. DANA inquired if a quorum of the Senate was formed? That circumstance, he thought, ought to be ascertained before the House adopted the gentleman’s resolution.

Mr. RANDOLPH did not know whether or no the Senate had formed a quorum, but he saw no objection on that account to proceeding with their own business. He, however, had understood that the Senate would form a quorum this day.

The resolution was carried, and Messrs. J. RANDOLPH and R. GRISWOLD appointed the committee.

WEDNESDAY, November 7.

Several other members, to wit: from Maryland, JOSEPH H. NICHOLSON; from Virginia, WALTER JONES; from South Carolina, THOMAS MOORE; and from Georgia, JOSEPH BRYAN, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

Mr. JOHN RANDOLPH, from the joint committee appointed to wait on the President of the United States, and inform him that a quorum of the two Houses is assembled, reported that the committee had performed that service, and that the President signified to them he would make a communication to this House, in writing, to-morrow at twelve o’clock.

THURSDAY, November 8.

Several other members, to wit: from New Hampshire, SAMUEL HUNT; from Massachusetts, SAMUEL TAGGART; from Connecticut, SIMEON BALDWIN and CALVIN GODDARD; and from North Carolina, SAMUEL D. PURVIANCE, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

A Message was received from the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, by Mr. BURWELL, his Secretary, as follows:

_Mr. Speaker_: I am directed to hand you a communication, in
writing, from the PRESIDENT to the two Houses of Congress.

The communication was read, and, together with the documents accompanying the same, referred to the Committee of the whole House on the state of the Union. [See Senate proceedings of this date, page 164, for the Message.]

_Sword to Decatur._

Mr. J. CLAY moved the following resolution:

_Resolved_, That the President of the United States be
requested to present, in the name of Congress, to Captain
Stephen Decatur, a sword, of the value of ---- dollars, and
to each of the officers and crew of the United States ketch
Intrepid, ---- months’ pay, as a testimony of the high sense
entertained by Congress of the gallantry, good conduct, and
services, of Captain Decatur, the officers, and crew, of the
said ketch, in attacking and destroying a Tripolitan frigate,
of forty-four guns, late the United States frigate Philadelphia.

_Ordered_, That the said motion be referred to a Committee of the Whole to-morrow.

FRIDAY, November 9.

Two other members, to wit: from Massachusetts, WILLIAM EUSTIS; and from Pennsylvania, ROBERT BROWN, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

_Frigate Philadelphia._

Mr. J. CLAY’s motion relative to Captain Decatur and the officers and crew of the ketch Intrepid, was taken up in Committee of the Whole.

On motion of Mr. CLAY, the resolution was altered, by striking out after the word “sword,” the words “the value of ---- dollars,” and filling up the other blank with the word “two,” thereby giving the officers and crew two months’ pay.

Mr. C., with a view of showing the propriety of the measure, read extracts of letters written by Commodore Preble and Lieutenant Decatur, which had been obtained from the Secretary of the Navy; they contained an account of the circumstances attending this honorable exploit, which have heretofore been printed in the public newspapers.

The committee rose and reported the resolution as amended.

Mr. GRISWOLD presumed the object of this step was to pay a tribute of respect to those brave men who had so gallantly achieved this glorious and dangerous enterprise. He wished to do this in a manner the most honorable and notorious, and perhaps the best course would be to obtain from the Head of the Navy Department, a list of the names of the officers and the number of the crew, together with a detail of the circumstances attending the event. With this view, he moved to postpone the consideration of the resolution reported by the Committee of the Whole, till to-morrow, in order to introduce a resolution to this effect:

_Resolved_, That the Secretary of the Navy be directed to
communicate to this House the name of the officers and the
number of the men employed in the destruction of the frigate
Philadelphia in the harbor of Tripoli, together with a
statement of the circumstances attending that event.

The postponement was agreed to without opposition, and the resolution of Mr. GRISWOLD was adopted, with a small variation, suggested by Mr. J. RANDOLPH, and acquiesced in by the mover, to wit: “That the President of the United States be requested to cause to be laid before this House,” etc.

Mr. J. CLAY and Mr. T. M. RANDOLPH were appointed a committee to wait on the PRESIDENT and communicate the request of the House.

MONDAY, November 12.

Several other members, to wit: from Massachusetts, PELEG WADSWORTH; from New Jersey, WILLIAM HELMS; from Delaware, CÆSAR A. RODNEY; from Virginia, MATTHEW CLAY; from North Carolina, MARMADUKE WILLIAMS and THOMAS WYNES; and from South Carolina, LEVI CASEY and RICHARD WINN, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

_British Treaty._

Mr. J. RANDOLPH informed the House that the Committee of Ways and Means had received a communication from the Treasury Department, stating that the appropriation of $50,000, for carrying into effect the seventh article of the British Treaty, had not been sufficient to discharge the second instalment upon all the awards made in pursuance thereof, and suggesting the propriety of making, as early as possible, a further appropriation for that object. The Secretary of State estimated the amount unpaid at $60,000, and that, in order to prevent any disappointment, it would be eligible to make the appropriation $70,000. Mr. R. hereupon moved that the Committee of Ways and Means have leave to report a bill on this subject. Leave being granted,

Mr. J. R. reported a bill accordingly, which was read a first and second time, and referred to a Committee of the Whole to-morrow.

TUESDAY, November 13.

Two other members, to wit: from Massachusetts, RICHARD CUTTS; and from South Carolina, WILLIAM BUTLER, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

No quorum being present, the House adjourned.

WEDNESDAY, November 14.

Another member, to wit, PHANUEL BISHOP, from Massachusetts, appeared, and took his seat in the House.

THURSDAY, November 15.

Two other members, to wit: from Massachusetts, SAMUEL THATCHER; and from Pennsylvania, ANDREW GREGG, appeared, and took their seats in the House.

A Message was received from the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, as follows:

_To the House of Representatives of the United States_:

Agreeably to your resolution of the ninth instant, I now lay
before you a statement of the circumstances attending the
destruction of the frigate Philadelphia, with the names of the
officers and the number of men employed on the occasion; to
which I have to add, that Lieutenant Decatur was, thereupon,
advanced to be a Captain in the Navy of the United States.

TH. JEFFERSON.

NOV. 15, 1804.

The said Message and the papers referred to therein, were read, and ordered to lie on the table.

MONDAY, November 19.

_Sword to Decatur._

The House proceeded to consider the resolution reported, on the ninth instant, from the Committee of the whole House, to whom was referred a motion relative “to Captain Stephen Decatur, the officers, and crew, of the United States ketch Intrepid;” and the said resolution being twice read, and amended at the Clerk’s table, was agreed to by the House, as follows:

_Resolved, by the Senate and House of Representatives of the
United States of America in Congress assembled_, That the
President of the United States be requested to present, in
the name of Congress, to Captain Stephen Decatur, a sword;
and to each of the officers and crew of the United States
ketch Intrepid, two months’ pay, as a testimony of the high
sense entertained by Congress of the gallantry, good conduct,
and services of Captain Decatur, the officers, and crew, of
the said ketch, in attacking, in the harbor of Tripoli, and
destroying a Tripolitan frigate of forty-four guns.

_Ordered_, That the said resolution be engrossed, and read the third time to-day.

TUESDAY, November 20.

Another member, to wit, GEORGE TIBBITS, from New York, appeared, and took his seat in the House.

WEDNESDAY, November 21.

_Louisiana Lead Mines._

The engrossed resolution authorizing the President to appoint an agent, who shall be instructed to collect all the material information respecting the actual condition, occupancy, and title of the lead mines in Louisiana, was taken up on its third reading.

Mr. LUCAS entertained a doubt as to the propriety of this measure; indeed, the gentleman from New York (Mr. MITCHILL) seemed to admit that it was superfluous, for he had said that the President, under proper authority, had already appointed agents to explore generally the Territory of Louisiana; that they have been some time engaged in that service at the Missouri, Arkansas, Red River, and about Detroit, and indeed Major Lewis had been some time in St. Louis, a post in the neighborhood of these very lead mines, and from his known enterprise and minute inquiries, there was good reason for believing that the subject which was the object of the proposed resolution, would be narrated in his general report of discoveries. But in addition to this expectation, the document accompanying the President’s Message sheds considerable light. The information as to the condition of the lead mines, their number, names, and value, were explained, and as he had heard no gentleman suggest a doubt as to the accuracy of the narrative, he was inclined to give it full credit, from the general character of the gentleman who made the communication, and the particular knowledge he must necessarily have acquired by a long residence in the country. From this view of the subject he was compelled to acknowledge that he had altered his idea of the resolution, and could not now vote in its favor.

Mr. MITCHILL had hoped that the gentleman from Pennsylvania, after the explanation of yesterday, would consent to the resolution; he would now add but a few explanatory words. The object of the resolution was simply to appoint an agent to inquire into the occupancy and titles of the present holders and claimants; this required a civilian versed in the municipal laws of the nations who had heretofore held that territory; not a natural historian, or mineralogist, not one who was acquainted with the art of mining, or smelting and testing ores. Neither did Mr. M. believe it would be necessary to send the agent to the mines themselves, but to the place where the deeds and conveyances constituting the title-papers of the proprietors, or pretended claimants, are recorded or preserved. Whether these were at New Orleans, or what other place, he did not know. As to the expense, it was not likely to exceed $1,000 or $2,000, even if the agent were sent from this city; but he imagined if the business could be as well conducted by the appointment of an agent in Louisiana, the President would instruct the Governor how to act. It might be seen too, from the words of the resolution, that it was a mere temporary employment, not likely to be of longer duration than three or four months, for the report is instructed to be made before the next meeting of Congress. Mr. M. concluded, that if Mr. LUCAS would reconcile himself to vote for the present motion upon this explanation, and should he hereafter desire a more extensive examination into the actual circumstances of the newly-acquired Territory, he might rely upon his earnest co-operation.

Mr. L. observed in reply, that Louisiana had been held alternately by three or four nations: each of which in sequence had granted titles to more or less of the lands in question. An examination into those titles would at this time excite a high degree of sensibility among the inhabitants, who, he thought, ought in their youthful state to be treated by Congress with tenderness and delicacy. The titles were various, some derived from the Governors of the country, some from commanders of posts. Many of the latter he believed might be considered by the agent illegal; especially as he had learned that the commander of St. Louis, in North Louisiana, held paramount authority over the subordinate posts, and that without his approbation the lands so granted would not be allowed; yet these persons held under such title, and by occupancy and improvement consider themselves the _bona fide_ proprietors of the lands. He feared that the inquiry intended by the resolution might create great dissatisfaction, while a postponement for the present could do no possible evil.

Mr. EARLY said, if Mr. L. had made a correct statement of the condition in which the titles in that country really stood, and he had no reason to doubt it, it would operate as the strongest reason on his mind to pass the resolution: though it would be perceived that the agency to be given on the present occasion extended no farther than to the lead mines. The gentleman, Mr. L., had yesterday mistaken his friend, Mr. MITCHILL’s object, supposing a general agency was intended to be raised. He had mistaken him again to-day, by thinking the agent was to go into the Territory of Louisiana to decide upon the titles he might have an opportunity of examining. This was not the case. He was merely to inquire into the actual condition of the lead mines, the occupancy and title, for the information of Congress. We are not going to send a Board of Commissioners, or a Judiciary Establishment, for the purpose of hearing and determining upon the claims set up, but to procure for ourselves that information which will enable the Government to decide, without their instrumentality. If the gentleman (Mr. L.) views the subject in this point of light, he will find it freed from his objection.

The question was now put, and the resolution passed, 74 members voting in its favor.

THURSDAY, November 22.

Two other members, to wit: PETERSON GOODWYN and EDWIN GRAY, from Virginia, appeared and took their seats in the House.

MONDAY, November 26.

_Preservation of Peace._

The House resolved itself into a Committee of the Whole on the bill for the more effectual preservation of peace in the ports and harbors of the United States, and in waters under their jurisdiction.

The first section authorizes the President and other proper officers to call in the aid of the militia, regular troops, or armed vessels, to execute civil process upon offenders who take refuge on board foreign armed vessels.

On motion of Mr. NICHOLSON, any commanding officer refusing to obey a requisition to this effect was subjected to a fine not exceeding five thousand dollars.

_Remission of Duties._

Mr. RANDOLPH called for the order of the day on the report of the Committee of Ways and Means respecting the remission of duties on books imported for the use of colleges and seminaries of learning--the resolution declaring it to be inexpedient to allow the same.

The House taking the subject into consideration--

Mr. J. RANDOLPH observed that the Constitution of the United States was a grant of limited powers for general objects, which Congress had no right to exceed, although they might think the powers too limited. This position he considered as of primary importance. Its leading feature was an abhorrence of exclusive privileges; it might be called the key to that instrument; every thing which rose up in the shape of privilege, was repressed in a peculiar manner, whether it related to orders or classes of men. Whenever they have touched the doctrine of privilege, the framers of that instrument, and the people of the United States adopting it, have been careful that nothing should be got by inference, or construction; the privileges of this House even have been precisely defined, and nothing is left for its extension, whatever may be the wishes or disposition of its members. The principle that this constitution is but a limited grant of power occurs, if not directly, yet frequently and effectually, so that it cannot be mistaken. On the privilege asked for, to permit colleges and universities to import their books free of impost, we refer to the eighth section of the first article, where it is declared that Congress shall have power to levy and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises; but all duties, imposts and excises, shall be uniform throughout the United States. The impost shall be uniform. It is a lamentable fact, but nevertheless it is a fact, and cannot be too much dwelt and insisted upon, nor too well known, that the ambiguity of language gives our constitution that character which leaves it in the power of civilians to say it means any thing or nothing. Whatever may have been said on other points, I think in this instance the language is so definite that it cannot possibly be mistaken. They shall be uniform, that is to say, there shall be but one quantum, one mode of collecting, and one manner; there shall not be two measures to mete with. If Congress undertake to exempt one class of people from the payment of the impost, they may exempt others also. If they begin with colleges and universities for the advancement of learning, surely they may go on to exempt the clergy and congregation for the advancement of religion; they may exempt their own members. Indeed, it cannot be seen where they are to stop, having once overleaped the constitutional barrier and entered on the wide field of privilege. The duties must be uniform! Nobody can be exempted: the President, if he chooses to import books, must pay the duty as well as any private citizen. In this country we have no privileged class, all must fare alike, every man must bend to the law, and the tax must be uniform whether on land or books.

Mr. FINDLAY observed, that in addition to the constitutional objections urged, he had others on the ground of expediency. The country colleges and seminaries whose funds were small, had seldom or never an opportunity of importing books; they were happy to receive them in the country as donations, or by cheap editions; they would therefore receive no corresponding accommodation, and yet they were more useful and their use more universally felt than those called higher institutions, which claim to be exempted from paying impost. There are only a few of the well-endowed academies that can afford to procure foreign books, and when they have them, their circulation is extremely confined; to say nothing more, these reasons would engage me to support the resolution.

Mr. R. GRISWOLD.--The gentleman from Virginia (Mr. RANDOLPH) must have misunderstood me when he supposed I objected to the report because the committee had assigned no reason for the resolution: I mentioned the circumstance merely to show that we ought not then to decide. With respect to the constitutional objection he has set up, I acknowledge it is new to me. Such an inquiry may be of great weight, but it does not appear so to me. The paragraph quoted from the eighth section of the first article, “that Congress shall have power to levy and collect taxes,” has never struck me in the way it has that gentleman. The words are, “levy and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises;” but it drops the word _taxes_, it being settled in another part of the constitution, and declares that duties, imposts, and excises shall be uniform. The one speaks of direct taxes, the other of indirect--meaning that if an indirect tax is laid, it shall be uniform. No one State is to have an excise laid upon its inhabitants unless it extends to the citizens of every other: one part is not to be excised and another excused. This has always been the construction of that section of the constitution till the present moment, and I think it the true one. It is now said that Congress can only promote science and literature in one way. Why, have not Congress made grants of lands to promote those objects in the Western country? They have. I believe the power of Congress adequate to promote literature in the way applied for; and it has been frequently the case that, even after duties have been paid into the Treasury upon the uniform system, yet individuals have had those duties returned. I do not want to detain the House; but I am well persuaded that the constitution forms no impediment, and the expediency must be apparent.

Mr. J. CLAY said he was one of the committee, and had agreed to the report. Since reasons had been called for, he would in a few words assign those which influenced him. The gentleman from Connecticut (Mr. DANA) mistakes in thinking that a denial to exempt books from impost is a tax on literary institutions, and therefore not uniform, as the constitution requires all imposts should be; but he did not make his stand on the ground of the constitution--he rested the question upon its expediency. Giving literary institutions the privilege of exemption from imposts would open a wide door for fraud: we should soon have them importing books for sale duty free, rivalling the booksellers, who are subjected to the payment of impost, and vending them in every street and avenue of the nation. But why privilege colleges and universities to accommodate the rich; for we may believe that the rich, and the children of the rich, are the only persons who have access to these collections? The poor have little leisure and less opportunity to improve the advantage which even _neighborhood_ would give them to peruse works of the kind alluded to; and sure it would be thought unjust to tax their pittance of imported articles, in order to enable gentlemen to read the classic authors, or the sublime and beautiful of the modern writers.

Mr. FINDLAY spoke of colleges, not of universities. We have three in Pennsylvania--one of them, to be sure, has also the title of university--but two of them have not funds to import books on their own account. It is only rich institutions that have this advantage: the poorer class of seminaries buy of booksellers, and pay them the impost as well as their retail profit. Indeed, this remission of duties will rather tend to create disgust than give satisfaction; and those seminaries which have large collections of books would be induced to sell them at their present price in order to procure new ones cheaper, as they have had to pay the duty on the former, but would have none to pay upon those they should hereafter import.

The question being called for, it was put on agreeing to the report of the Committee of the Whole, that it is inexpedient to remit the duty on books, and carried in the affirmative--seventy-nine members voting in the affirmative.

The House then adjourned.

WEDNESDAY, November 28.

_Potomac River._

The House resolved itself into a Committee of the Whole on the bill authorizing the corporation of Georgetown to make a dam or causeway from Mason’s Island to the western shore of the river Potomac.

Mr. MACON (Speaker) moved to strike out the first section of the bill, with a view of trying its merits.

Mr. J. RANDOLPH seconded the motion of his respectable friend, (the Speaker.) The river Potomac was the joint property of the States of Maryland and Virginia under compact between those States. This property, at least on the part of Virginia, had never been relinquished. Congress, in his conception, had no right to pass the law in question; but if they had, there was another objection. The corporation of Georgetown were empowered to lay a tax which would be unequal and oppressive, since the property on which it was to be levied would not be equally benefited by deepening the harbor, supposing that effect to be accomplished. He hoped a prompt rejection of the bill would serve as a general notice to the inhabitants of the District to desist from their daily and frivolous applications to Congress, to the great obstruction of the public business.

Mr. SMILIE understood there was a rival interest between the towns of Alexandria and Georgetown, and as this rivalry had been exhibited on many former occasions, he deemed it proper, before they passed any bill for the encouragement of either place, that the parties should be obliged to publish their intentions some weeks before the application, that if there were any objections to the measure contemplated, they might be before the House at the same time. He stated this merely as a ground of postponement, not saying whether he was in favor or against the measure.

Mr. GREGG thought the House bound to legislate for these people, until they relinquished the claim to the jurisdiction, either by authorizing them to legislate for themselves, or retroceding them to the States to which they originally belonged. He approved of the idea of publishing, as expressed by his colleague, (Mr. SMILIE,) which he considered absolutely necessary. If Alexandria were opposed to the bill, it is probable they would have sent in a memorial on the subject before this time; their not having done so inclined him to believe that they were satisfied that the measure should go into operation. He did not think the bill perfect, but nevertheless he should not oppose its progress.

Mr. LEWIS said the landholders of Georgetown had very generally signed the petition to Congress. And no person out of the walls of this House gave it opposition. The people of Alexandria were content, and the owner of the island and the west shore of the river was the person most likely to be affected, yet he had given it his hearty assent. He was well persuaded that no injury would be done to the navigation of the Eastern branch, or to the port of Alexandria; if, therefore, they could render a benefit to Georgetown, without injuring any other property, he trusted the House would agree to the bill.

Mr. SLOAN felt interested in the result of this measure. The people here have nobody to look to but Congress to make legislative provision for their well-being; he therefore considered it a duty to attend to their desires; but he wished the applicants to give notice of their intentions, in order that any person conceiving himself likely to be aggrieved should have an opportunity of being heard. This was the usual course pursued in the State where he resided.

Mr. CLAIBORNE was by no means satisfied that the removal of the mud bank would do no injury to the Eastern branch and to Alexandria.

Mr. NELSON said that on a question so important to the upper parts of Maryland and Virginia, he could not refrain from stating some reasons in favor of the measure, and against the motion of the Speaker, which was intended to destroy the bill. It had been urged that the sediment which now obstructed the navigation to Georgetown, if set afloat by increasing the current and volume of water across it, would impede the navigation of the Eastern branch or fill up the harbor of Alexandria. Those who would take a view of the Eastern branch would be convinced it could make no deposit there, it being intercepted or turned aside by the point which projected into the Potomac; and as the water of the Eastern branch was more rapid than the Potomac, the breadth of the latter being much wider than the former, there certainly was no danger to be apprehended in that quarter. As to Alexandria, it was not to be supposed that the solid mass of sediment was to be taken off the bar at once and lodged in that harbor; the probability was, it would remove gradually and deposit at the eddy on each side of the river, while the union of the Eastern branch with the Potomac would increase the celerity of the current and carry it far below Alexandria.

The compact mentioned by the gentleman from Virginia (Mr. RANDOLPH) between the States of Maryland and Virginia, he acknowledged to exist; but as the measure contemplated the improvement of the navigation of the Potomac, instead of obstructing it, the right of each State to the free navigation thereof remained unimpaired. He imagined that the inhabitants of Alexandria and the citizens of Virginia wished success to the measure. He knew his constituents had it much at heart, knowing that a choice of markets is a great accommodation to farmers; and if defeated, it would be as much to their advantage to bring their produce to a shipping port at once by land, as to use the canal recently constructed at such prodigious expense, having afterwards to go with their produce to Alexandria by land.

Mr. SMILIE should not be against the bill, if upon full and fair inquiry it was found proper to pass it. But he could not agree to be hurried along without allowing time to acquire information. He therefore moved that the committee rise and report progress.

Mr. MACON (Speaker) opposed the rising of the committee, because it was leaving the business exactly where it stood, unless it was meant to recommit it to a select committee for modification. But as he was determined to vote against it in any and every shape, he was prepared to decide now. As to the mode he had taken to come at his object, he should only say it was a fair one, and such as had been the uniform practice of the House since he had a seat in it.

The gentlemen in favor of this dam or causeway, say it will do no harm; but where is the demonstration? On the other side, serious apprehensions are entertained of its injurious effects upon the United States navy yard in the Eastern branch, and its causing obstructions in the harbor of Alexandria. He would assure the committee he was ready to promote the welfare of any of the citizens; but it must in justice be done, without injuring any other portion whatever.

At the last session, an application was made for a permanent bridge across the Potomac, with a draw for the passage of vessels; the petitioner urged the general utility of the measure to all persons travelling North or South, but particularly the vast benefit accruing to the inhabitants of the district, by affording a solid and secure means of intercourse between its several parts. This measure was opposed by the present petitioners, on the ground of the compact between Maryland and Virginia securing the right of free navigation to the river, and also alleging that their navigation to Georgetown would be impeded. The argument which they applied then, now applies against them, and it ought, in the minds of the same legislators, to apply with equal success.

Mr. FINDLAY was rather in favor of the bill, believing the mode proposed would be successful in deepening the channel, which would certainly improve the navigation to and from Georgetown, and in that object the citizens of some of the western counties of Pennsylvania were materially interested; several of their boatable creeks nearly interlocking with those of the Potomac. He would, however, agree to the committee rising, with a view to postpone the bill, until gentlemen acquired the information they asked for.

Mr. GODDARD hoped the committee would rise, and the subject be postponed until sufficient light was obtained to guide their votes to a proper decision. He also hoped that no member might be considered as the friend or the foe of the present bill, until he became such by an examination into its merits or demerits. He narrated the course the business had taken since its introduction into this House, and inferred that the same deliberate mode ought to be pursued to the end. Whether the measure was good or evil could only be determined in that way, and gentlemen ought not to object to doing positive good, unless it was demonstrated that positive evil would result to counterbalance the good that was intended. He conceived the members ought to inquire for themselves on this point, and legislate accordingly. He would on all occasions endeavor to promote the interests of the district; and as it had no immediate representative on the floor, he considered every representative bound to serve them, while the seat of Government remained among them.

Mr. G. W. CAMPBELL would not declare whether he should vote for the final passage of the bill or not. But he was disposed to take notice of the applications made from time to time by the inhabitants of the district; whether to redress grievances, or procure benefits. But he by no means approved of the principles of legislation without representation. He regretted that they were placed in this unfortunate situation; but he should decide on the present question according to its merits; and if it was found to be of great consequence to the petitioners, and not likely to work an injury to others, he presumed the bill would finally pass. But he wished the committee to rise, in order to give further time to obtain information. It had been alleged that the friends of the measure ought to demonstrate that the erection of a causeway would do no injury to any one. This was not a fair position; it was requiring them to prove a negative. The burden of proof should lie on those who oppose the bill, and it was for them to demonstrate that injury would result. The gentleman from Virginia (Mr. J. RANDOLPH) has stated that the boats from the western country have a choice of passing by the western or eastern channel to the market below Georgetown, and this, it is presumed, he means they should be still entitled to under the compact between Maryland and Virginia. Let us hear from those persons also, and then ascertain whether they have any objection to the project on that account. This was also an argument in favor of the rising of the committee, and perhaps it may be added, that a little delay will enable the House so to modify the bill as to render it less exceptionable than at present.

Mr. SOUTHARD had not considered this subject of much consequence in the outset, but he found that its importance increased as it toiled along. He thought this morning it would have occupied but a short portion of their time; in that he found himself deceived; and he believed he was not singular in these opinions. He suspected many other members were in the same predicament. He therefore would vote for the committee’s rising. That navigable waters are considered as highways, is a matter of great notoriety; but he did not know that to deepen a channel, by contracting its surface, was considered as obstructing the free navigation of a river, nor could he conceive that the body of sediment meant to be removed, would descend _en masse_ and deposit itself at the confluence of the next stream it met. On the contrary, he imagined it would be separated by the force of the current giving it action into millions of particles, some of which would settle promiscuously on either side, while a part would ultimately be deposited in the ocean.

The committee hereupon rose and reported progress, and asked leave to sit again. On the question, Shall the committee have leave to sit again?

Mr. J. RANDOLPH requested that the act of cession by Virginia might be read, by which it would clearly appear that she had not ceded, or intended to cede to the United States any right acquired under her compact with Maryland. [The act was read.]

It is plain from the preamble, said Mr. R., that the intention of the State was to make a cession above the tide water; that the expected seat of Government would be fixed in some place contiguous to the limits of Maryland and Pennsylvania. It is not contended that the United States were bound to select any particular spot. This circumstance is mentioned only to show what was contemplated at the time by the Legislature of Virginia. Her act of cession was more broad. It extended to any tract of country not exceeding ten miles square, “to be located within the limits of the State.” Over this she had relinquished to Congress her jurisdiction as well of soil as of persons. But her limits did not extend beyond high water mark on the western bank of the Potomac. Her right of highway on the river was a natural right acknowledged and secured by convention with Maryland. Her civil jurisdiction over its waters was a conventional right, entirely derived from compact with that State, was a jurisdiction not within her limits, and which the words of the act just read could not embrace or convey.

Mr. DAWSON would vote against the committee having leave to sit again. He was convinced that the objection made by his colleague (Mr. J. RANDOLPH) was conclusive: the fact was, that neither Maryland nor Virginia had ceded their joint rights to this river, nor could they do so, by their separate acts; the terms of the compact requiring that any thing done respecting the navigation of the Potomac, should be done by their joint act. It was worthy of remark, that the petitioners for the causeway were the identical persons who petitioned against the bridge as a violation of the compact between the two States, and denied the authority of Congress to legislate on the subject of the navigation of the Potomac. He thought them right then, and he voted against the bridge. His opinion had not changed with their opinions, and, therefore, he should vote against the causeway now.

Mr. R. GRISWOLD said that from the vote just taken, he presumed that the question of expediency had been settled. But it is now objected that Congress have no exclusive jurisdiction over the Potomac. In reply he would submit a few observations. By the constitution, Congress were empowered to exercise exclusive jurisdiction over any place not exceeding ten miles, which might be ceded by particular States. The States of Maryland and Virginia had ceded this district to Congress, and the cession had been accepted. But the gentleman from Virginia (Mr. RANDOLPH) had said that Virginia did not cede the jurisdiction of the Potomac, because she did not own it separately. To this he would answer, that the river Potomac must have been under the jurisdiction of either Maryland or Virginia, or both. And as both allowed Congress to accept of any part of their territory not exceeding ten miles square, and Congress had chosen to accept of part from one and part from the other, he presumed the jurisdiction of the Potomac, let it have been held by either of the States, or jointly, must have passed to the United States. He was of opinion, that if Congress had no jurisdiction over the Potomac, they had none over the district. The constitution provides only for the cession of one district of country not exceeding ten miles square. The act of Congress, made in pursuance of the constitution, had also provided for the laying out one district. If the arguments of the gentleman from Virginia were correct, and Congress had no jurisdiction over the Potomac, the Commissioners and the then President of the United States, under whose direction the district was laid off, had been mistaken, and had taken two districts of territory instead of one. This being the case, Congress had no jurisdiction in the district, because it not being laid off conformably to the constitution and the law of Congress, the acceptance by Congress was absolutely void. If this was correct, there was an absolute necessity for giving leave to the committee to sit again, for the purpose of deliberating whether Congress had jurisdiction or not. If they had not, and were legislating for the people of the district without authority, the sooner they put an end to such an assumption of power, the better.

Mr. J. RANDOLPH declared that the opinion which he had just given was the result of his most deliberate judgment. To what it might lead he should not at that time undertake to determine; but when that question should come before the House he was not sure that he should deny the corollary of the gentleman from Connecticut, (Mr. R. GRISWOLD,) at least as far as related to the testimony on the other side of the river. The question, however, then was, whether Congress possessed exclusive jurisdiction over the Potomac. How could they acquire it? From Maryland? It was more than she had to give. At farthest she could only grant her own qualified right. Had they obtained it from Virginia? Not at all. She had granted a jurisdiction exclusively her own, over a tract of country within her limits. And could any man pretend to say that this was a grant of her concurrent jurisdiction over the Potomac, confessedly without her limits? She had, to use the expression, issued her warrant to Congress, to be located somewhere within the State, and, under this pretext, her property out of the State was about to be usurped. Suppose the gentleman from Connecticut were to convey by deed his exclusive property, by certain metes and bounds, would his joint interest in other property not contained within those bounds pass by such a deed? Surely not. To a person setting up a claim to such property he would probably say, produce the evidence of your title; and in like manner Mr. R. demanded to be shown the conveyance by which Virginia had relinquished her concurrent jurisdiction over the Potomac? And in answer to this, gentlemen refer to a conveyance relinquishing something else in nowise connected with it, and tell us we always believed that we had a grant for this jurisdiction; we shall be grievously disappointed if we have not; it will be a great inconvenience to us to do without it, and, therefore, we must have it. And Virginia is to be forcibly dispossessed of her right, to suit the convenience of Congress.

Mr. NELSON said, it was with diffidence he again troubled the House after the lengthy discussion which had taken place. But doubts having been originated as to the authority of Congress to pass the bill in question, he felt compelled to remove those doubts, as far as lay in his power. As the House had decided the expediency of the measure by a large majority, if upon an investigation it should be demonstrated that Congress possessed ample power to pass the bill, he trusted the same majority would still be found in favor of it. He would proceed to examine the power which Congress possessed to pass the bill, and he trusted that he should be able to satisfy a majority of the House, that they had sufficient power. Previous to the compact between Virginia and Maryland, which had been so much talked of, Maryland claimed the sole jurisdiction of the Potomac river, and Virginia claimed Cape Henry and Cape Charles, also the jurisdiction of the Pocomoke as her property. In order to prevent any duties from being imposed upon their vessels at either of those places, the two States entered into a compact by which Maryland agreed that the navigation of the Potomac should be free to the people of Virginia, and Virginia contracted not to impose duties on the vessels of Maryland coming by Cape Henry, or navigating the Pocomoke. By this compact, the Potomac became the joint property of Maryland and Virginia as to the free navigation, but all the islands were under the jurisdiction of Maryland. This being the situation, each of these States, by a law, ceded to Congress any part of their territory not exceeding ten miles square, which they might choose to accept. Congress chose to accept of part from one and part from the other; and, among the rest, this joint property the river Potomac. There was no exception made in the act of cession as to the water courses, and it would be needless to inform the members that a grant of land necessarily carried with it a grant of the waters thereon, unless an exception was made.

Mr. J. RANDOLPH.--The gentleman asks in the body of what county is the river Potomac passing through the District of Columbia? Will he take it for an answer that its jurisdiction is within the bodies of the same counties it was in before the acceptance of the territory on each side?

In addition to the observations made on passing joint property with exclusive property, suppose England and France to hold Malta in joint possession, and that they cede to Germany, for her acquiescence in that measure, some of the exclusive property held by each within the German empire, will they say that their joint property in Malta passed by the treaty?

Mr. CLARK was unwilling to trouble the House at that late hour with any remarks, and would have entirely forborne, was not the question on which we were about to decide, and which had become extremely important, susceptible of a position which it had not assumed. It had been stated, and generally agreed to, and he supposed was correct, that the State of Maryland, previous to her compact with Virginia, rightfully claimed the whole river Potomac to the high-water mark on the western bank. Virginia owned the Capes. This collision of interest produced, in the year 1786, an adjustment of their interfering interests, and it was expressly stipulated that the river Potomac should remain a highway, free for the navigation of each State. In the year 1799, the Legislature of Virginia passed a law making a cession to the United States of a territory ten miles square, or any less quantity that should be accepted for the seat of the General Government, to be located and laid off within her limits; thus by the terms of her cession confining it to her territory. Maryland, nearly at the same period, made a similar cession. Out of these two cessions is the present Columbian Territory made. It is contended by the gentleman from Maryland, (Mr. NELSON,) that the two States uniting in the cession makes the grant complete, and the right in the United States predominant and exclusive. He acknowledges, at the same time, this correct principle that they could grant no greater right than they possessed. This doctrine I hold incontrovertible, that the alienee can have no greater or better title than the alienor, otherwise the derivative would be superior to the original title, a principle not to be admitted.

Let it be distinctly recollected that, prior to the cession, Virginia had purchased a right out of the soil of her sister State, distinct from the land--an incorporeal hereditament, a franchise which she had the right of exercising, unconnected with the use of the soil--so that, while Maryland owned the land, Virginia owned the right of way. She never passed this right by the terms of her cession or by any other act. Maryland could not, having already parted from it. No strength of argument can be derived from the terms of the constitution; for, if Virginia never parted with her right, the United States could never have acquired it. I trust I have shown that Virginia purchased a right in the navigation of the Potomac, which she never parted from, and, of course, retains to this moment. We, therefore, cannot constitutionally legislate on this subject.

Let it not be said that the object is improvement and not obstruction. Is not building the wall from Mason’s Island to the Virginia shore an obstruction, and the improvement at best problematical? But, this is begging the question. On a fair admission of my construction, I contend, and have endeavored to prove, that we possessing no jurisdiction over the river, it cannot be touched by any legislative act of ours in any point whatever. For, if it be touched in one way, it may be in another, and may finally end in whatever arrangement Congress may think expedient to make.

Mr. JACKSON did not stop to inquire whether it was proper for Congress to retain the jurisdiction over this district, but he was willing to remove a grievance which the people complained of and required to be done. He was not one of those who was disposed to guard the people against their worst enemies, themselves, as he did not believe the doctrine to be true. The objection that Virginia and Maryland had only ceded their exclusive property, and not the joint property of the free navigation of the Potomac, might, perhaps, be extended further than gentlemen wished, or were aware of. By the Treaty of Paris, France had ceded Louisiana in full sovereignty to the United States, but expressly reserved the right of free navigation of the Mississippi; if, then, the United States were disposed to shorten the navigation by cutting through the bend of that river, or in any other way improve the same, will it be necessary for the United States to consult and obtain the assent of France to the measure before they ventured to put it in execution?