Chapter V: Excerpt From Report of Mr. Peterkin, General Inspector of Board (57)

14,704. Do you refer to the difficulty which they have in getting money for their work?-Yes; and to the fact that they get goods, chiefly drapery goods, for it.

14,705. Do you think that induces them to take larger quantity of dress than they really need?-I think so.

14,706. But at the same time you say that they do not have a sufficient amount of good underclothing?-Yes. I do not think they have a sufficient amount of good, warm, substantial underclothing for the climate in which they live.

14,707. Might they not get that if they required it in return for their work?-I suppose they might, but the fact is that they very seldom have it. They rather prefer to take showy outside clothing.

14,708. If women are reduced to distress for food, but yet have a considerable supply of handsome clothing, would you not suppose it natural that they should have recourse to the pawnbroker's shop in winter, or when they were in straits?-I would, but I am not quite sure if there is a pawnbroker's shop here. There is a sort of pawn in the town, but I don't think it is much resorted to. I have no doubt, if they were in a large city, they would resort to the pawnbroker's; but pawnbroking is practically unknown here. The people, some way or other, have not got into the way of it.

14,709. Have you known any cases in which women, in a state of distress for food, have sold their clothes to private individuals for it, or have endeavoured to do so?-I am aware that there are one or more old women employed, either regularly or occasionally, in going round the houses and hawking clothes which had been obtained by knitters for their goods. On one occasion I met in with one of these women. I was seeing a patient in the house of one of the lower orders, and the woman came in with some article of children's clothing to sell. I inquired how she had got it, and I was told that she was hawking it for some person who had got it for knitting goods.

14,710. Then she had not bought it, but was selling it as the agent of another person?-Yes. She was selling it, as I understood, as the agent of the knitter.

14,711. Have you had opportunities of obtaining any knowledge with regard to the amount of immorality which prevails in Lerwick?-I have heard, and I have reason to believe, that it prevails to a very considerable extent; but I have had no means of obtaining any accurate knowledge on the subject.

14,712. Are you aware whether the amount of professional prostitution is greater in Lerwick than in other places of the same size?-I am not very well acquainted with small towns similar to Lerwick; there are only one or two small towns that I know well. I am better acquainted with large cities, such as Edinburgh and Aberdeen; but I scarcely think that in Lerwick there is a greater amount of professionals prostitution, in proportion to the size of the place, than there would be in a seaport town of a similar size.

14,713. Would you say there was a larger amount of occasional prostitution?-I believe there is. I don't think I could prove it, but I have good reason to believe so.

14,714. Is that from knowledge which you have obtained in the discharge of your professional duties, or is it from general observation?-It is partly from hearsay, and partly from general observation.

14,715. Can you ascribe that in any degree to the system of barter which prevails?-I think it may to a large extent be accounted for by that system; because the knitters, I believe, are insufficiently supplied with food, and they are supplied with plenty of handsome clothing. They are thus led to walk about the streets good deal, and are in that way led into evil courses.

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14,716. Is that an opinion which you have entertained for some time?-Yes. I think it is to be expected in the ordinary course of events, that if women, have insufficient food and plenty of showy clothing, they will be more apt to go astray than others who have comfortable homes, and plenty of food and clothing in keeping with their position in life.

14,717. You are aware, I presume, that statistics show the amount of illegitimacy in Shetland to be less than it is in many parts of Scotland?-I am aware of that.

14,718. Is not that inconsistent to some extent, or apparently inconsistent, with the opinion you have expressed about the state of morals in Lerwick?-It is apparently inconsistent; but I am afraid that in Shetland we get credit for a higher state of morality than we are entitled to, in the country districts.

14,719. Do you mean that the system of registration here is not efficient?-I mean merely that the Registrar General's returns do not always show that illegitimacy corresponds with immorality.

14,720. Is that in consequence of the marriages being celebrated at such times as show the existence of what clergymen call antenuptial fornication?-It is partly in consequence of that, but not altogether.

14,721. Then is it possible to reconcile these statistics entirely with the prevalence of an excessive amount of immorality?-I have heard attempts to explain it, but I don't know if they were satisfactory. However, it is such a delicate matter that I would rather not enter further into it.

14,722. Have you no satisfactory explanation to give on the subject?-No.

14,723. Has it fallen within your observation, that the want of food has had any physical effect upon the women employed in knitting?-I remember being recently told by a respectable married woman, who was very well acquainted with the habits of knitting girls, that many of them enjoyed very good health, and felt pretty well and vigorous during the first two or three days of the week, but became languid towards the end of it; and she explained that circumstance in this way: These girls got an extra supply of food on the Saturday night, and they walked about a good deal during the Sunday, which, as it were, recruited them; but towards the end of the week their supplies got exhausted, and they did not enjoy much out-door exercise, and therefore became languid.

14,724. How do you account for their obtaining an extra supply of food on the Saturday night?-They were probably settling then. Many of them, I may explain, are not mere knitters, but are otherwise occupied. They are very ready, I believe, to take other work when they can get it, and many of them live not wholly by their own exertions, but partly on their parents and friends; therefore there would be extra supplies of food and groceries going into the house on the Saturday night, which they had enjoyed during the first days of the week.

14,725. Have you been aware of cases in which the way of dealing has led to the formation of imprudent habits on the part of the women?-I think they are very extravagant as regards dress.

14,726. Do they also expend a great deal of money on what may be called luxuries in food, rather than upon what is necessary, when they have money?-I think they do. The lower orders in Shetland use a very large amount of tea, much more than is good for them. It is very strong tea, and they take it very frequently during the day-I think to an unwholesome extent. I think it injures their health very considerably.

14,727. Is oatmeal still used to a great extent as an article of diet?-It is used in the country districts, but I think not so much in Lerwick. Here it is more loaf bread that is used.

14,728. In what form is oatmeal generally used in the houses of the poorer Shetlanders?-I think it is chiefly in cakes, what would be called scones in Scotland. I don't think it is so much in porridge, so far as I am aware.

14,729. Is that the bulk of the diet of a fisherman's family?-That, and fish and potatoes.

14,730. Don't you think that, taking the Shetlanders as a body, they are as well off with regard to diet and clothing as any similar class in Scotland?-I think the peasantry in the country are so, on the whole. The lower orders in Lerwick differ considerably from those in the country districts; there are more employments open to them. I think the people in the country are better fed, on the whole, than those in Lerwick. They enjoy more fresh air, and are a better-off class of people, on the whole, than the lower orders here.

14,731. Has any special matter come within your observation that you think of mentioning with regard to the system of barter in other trades than hosiery?-Nothing very special. I think the system of the men being compelled to fish to the landlords or tacksmen on certain estates is a bad system, and should be abolished. One of the many evils resulting from it is that very often men don't know whether they have money or are in debt. They may think they have means, and at settling time they may discover they have nothing.

14,732. Would that not happen all the same if the creditor were a merchant who had no connection with the land?-It might, it arises from the system of long credits.

14,733. Have you known cases in which a man was under a false impression as to the balance at his banker's, as one may say?-I have. The other day a man in the country sent for me to visit his wife professionally; and on leaving he told me he had not the means in the house, but that he had sufficient to pay me, and good deal more, at the merchant's. I afterwards saw the merchant with whom he dealt, and he told me something similar. He also told me to send the man's account to him, which I did; but a few weeks afterwards the merchant wrote me that he had been mistaken,- that he found, instead of the man having means in his hands, that he was in debt, and he had had to advance him his rent, and that I could not get my account paid in the meantime; but that he would do his best to get it for me at a future time.

14,734. Is it a common thing to have accounts paid in that way through the merchant?-Very common.

14,735. The merchant, in short, appears in many cases to transact the whole of a man's business affairs?-Yes; he appears to pay his rent very often, and to transact other business for him.

14,736. He pays accounts for him of all sorts?-Yes.

14,737. So that the man may know nothing at all of his money affairs?-He may know little or nothing.

14,738. Do you speak of that as being a general thing within your own knowledge?-Yes.

14,739. Have you formed any opinion as to the effect of that system of dependence upon the merchant upon the character of the people generally?-Yes; they are deficient in that sturdy independence, if I may so express it, which characterizes the peasantry throughout the rest of Scotland. The system fosters a dependent, time-serving, deceitful disposition, and it cripples enterprise.

14,740. Don't you find at the same time that the people are generally very well able to take care of themselves in any ordinary transaction? They have intelligence sufficient?-Yes; they are sharp enough. The Shetland peasantry possess very considerable intelligence; but there is in them a want of proper independence.

14,741. Do you mean that the position in which they are develops a kind of cunning rather than acuteness or cleverness?-Yes; it fosters a sort of low cunning. The system having been continued, one might almost say, for centuries has fostered that element in their character.

14,742. That you represent as being the principal defect in the Shetland character?-It is one of the principal defects.

14,743. In other respects, do you not think they are a very superior class to the ordinary run of peasantry in Scotland?-They are careful and intelligent, and they are [Page 371] pretty well-bred. They have a good deal of the <suaviter in modo>, more so than the most of peasants but there is that want of proper independence amongst them which I have mentioned, and they are of a very conservative disposition. I mean by that, that there is a want of desire to better themselves; for instance, to improve their houses, or to produce better crops, or to educate their families. There is a want of proper ambition among them; they are content to remain very much as they are.

14,744. Do you mean to represent that as being the effect of the system of barter which prevails?-I think it is partly the result of the system of barter, and partly of the short leases which are given of the land, and the want of any encouragement to improve their land and houses.

14,745. As a rule, the houses in Shetland are still in a very defective condition?-Very much so indeed. As far as we can see, they are in the same condition as they have been for centuries.

14,746. Are there many districts in the country where the houses still consist of a single room and have no chimney?-There are a good many instances in which they want chimneys, but they have generally two apartments-a but and a ben end, as it is called.

14,747. In such houses how is an exit furnished for the smoke?- Just through holes in the roof called 'lums;' but I am glad to observe a disposition to correct that in some districts. In many houses lately I have noticed that they have built wooden chimneys, and these improve the houses very much.

14,748. That has been so in Unst; but perhaps your professional duties don't take you so far?-I have not been in Unst for some years.

14,749. But in the course of your professional visits you have to travel over the whole extent of the mainland?-Yes, over the most of it.

14,750. Formerly, I understand, glazed windows were very rare in Shetland?-Very rare.

14,751. Has there been a change in that respect in recent years?- Yes, a very considerable change; but in some of the more primitive districts glazed windows do not exist yet.

14,752. In that case, is the light only admitted by the door?-Only by the door, and the lum or hole in the roof.

14,753. Are there many houses of that description in Shetland still?-A good many. I am afraid I could not say accurately how many.

14,754. Can you say whether these houses are inhabited by people who are pretty well-to-do as peasants?-Yes; I believe many of them are pretty well-to-do. They have bits of ground, and good earnings from their fishing, and are free of debt; and probably many of them have some means, although that is not known. It is one peculiarity of their character, that they don't like it to be known when they have money. I believe many of the men have considerable means in the banks, but they conceal it.

14,755. Have you had occasion to observe that yourself?-I don't know that I have had direct occasion to observe it; but I have heard it, and I believe it to be the fact.

14,756. Is it the current belief among those with whom you converse, that there are many of the fishermen who have means of their own, which they conceal from other people?-Yes.

14,757. What would you say was the character of the Shetland people with regard to sobriety?-I should say that, on the whole, they are very sober and steady; and I may give an illustration of that. It is well known that the Shetlanders as seamen are very highly prized at ports in the south, such as Liverpool and Shields; and very often a shipmaster, when desiring a crew, will put into the advertisement 'Shetland men preferred.' I believe the reason for that preference is not so much that the Shetlanders are better seamen, although they are as good if not better than others, but because they are more steady and more to be depended upon. For instance, I have heard of a shipmaster who, if he had occasion to land at Quebec or some port in America, and had to take a boat's crew on shore with him to bring him back again at night, he would select the Shetland men in his crew for that purpose if there were any, as he was more sure of having them in waiting for him at the time he wanted. That is not the result of personal observation, but it is what I have heard on good authority. I may state further, as a proof of their sobriety, that I have had occasion to examine it very large number of Shetland seamen in my capacity as Admiralty surgeon and agent. I have held that office for five and a half years, and during that time I have examined probably between 500 and 600 men, and I almost never yet found any traces amongst them of venereal disease, which is it very common thing amongst seamen. That is a proof of the steady habits of the Shetland men.

14,758. I understand there are very few public-houses in Shetland?-Very few. I think there is only one public-house in the mainland of Shetland outside of Lerwick, but there are several places holding grocers' licences where the men can buy liquor.

14,759. Is there anything further you wish to say?-I don't know that there is anything further, except that I may state it as my opinion, that it would be better, both for merchants and their customers, if the barter system were abolished and all transactions were carried on in cash. I believe the system of long credits is very injurious to all the parties concerned in it.

14,760. Do you think habits of independence would be fostered among the Shetland people if they received their wages or other payments in cash?-Yes; habits of independence and enterprise would be fostered, and I believe the merchants would be able to make better use of their money by turning over their capital more frequently.

Lerwick, January 29, 1872, PETER MOODIE, examined.

14,761. Are you it seaman and fisherman in Lerwick?-I am.

14,762. Have you been for a number of years at the sealing and whaling?-I have been at it since 1855, exclusive of two years when I was south.

14,763. Did you always ship from Lerwick?-Always.

14,764. From what agent?-I have been from them all. The first year I shipped was from Hay & Co., the next from Mr. Leask; and I have been from Hay & Co., Mr. Leask, and Mr. George Reid Tait ever since.

14,765. Did you get your outfit from Hay & Co. in 1855?-I did. I was then a boy, and I was glad to get it from them, because I had no person to give it to me except the agent.

14,766. Is it usual for green hands to get their outfit from the agent who employs them?-Yes. I don't think they would get it from any one else.

14,767. Did you pay off your outfit in the first year?-I did, and I had something to get.

14,768. Have you always had something to get ever since?-No, not every year. One year our ship had to come home because the master had fallen from the mast-head, and I was not clear with the agent upon voyage; but I shipped again to Davis Straits, and I did clear it off before the end of the season.

14,769. Do you always get a large quantity of supplies from the agent you ship with?-If I want it, I do, but if I like, I can get my first month's advance and my half-pay ticket; only, I find that the agents can supply me with everything I wish, and I have not taken a halfpay ticket except in one year, and I sold it as soon as I got it. I found, however, that I could get my goods as cheap from the agents as from the grocer's shop; and besides, I found that when I took my ticket to a grocer he did not like it. But the agents will allow you to take whatever you want. I have seen me go into an agent's shop in Lerwick about Christmas, and he would advance me 10s. or 15s. or £1 if I wanted it, and I paid him up for it, perhaps in the course of the [Page 372] next year; whereas I don't think many of the grocers would have advanced me one penny.

14,770. Don't you think your wife could have got her goods cheaper if she had had the money to pay for them?-No. I have never found that I could get them any cheaper. I have had groceries from a grocer's shop, and I have had the same things from agents, and I have found them to be all the same price.

14,771. It was the practice some years settle your accounts at the agent's shop, just in the same way that a fisherman settles with his curer at the end of the season?-Yes, we did that regularly.

14,772. For some years back, however, you have had your wages paid to you at the Custom House?-Yes.

14,773. Have you had them paid without any deduction except your advance?-Yes, except that and the ship's bill. If I had taken any goods from the agent before I went out, of course I got my money, and I could go and pay him when I wanted. He did not take it from me at the Custom House.

14,774. Did the agent ever seek to deduct the amount of his account at the Custom House?-Never from me. I cannot speak for anybody but myself.

14,775. Did you never see it attempted?-I did one year, but that was before they understood exactly how it was to be done. They had made out our account of wages so that the amount of their account was taken off; but as soon as we came to the Shipping Office, the shipping master told the agent that it was not to be done in that way. He altered our accounts of wages so that the money was all given to us, and then we went back to the agent's shop and paid him.

14,776. Was that in 1867 or 1868?-I don't remember which it was. I think it was in 1867.

14,777. Has any deduction of that sort been made since?-Never from me.

14,778. Do you always go straight down from the Custom House to the agent's office and settle your account with him?-I generally do so, if I think the agent is in his office; but if he is settling with some others besides, and has to wait with them at the Custom House, I may wait until the next day and then go along and settle it.

14,779. Do you generally go down from the Custom House in company with the agent or the clerk who has been paying you?- Generally I do. I think it is as well to pay my debt as long as I am able, rather than to spend the money, and perhaps not be able to pay afterwards.

14,780. Have you any difficulty in getting an engagement in a good ship?-I have never had any difficulty in getting an engagement from any of the agents I applied to, either from Hay & Co. or Mr Leask or Mr Tait. If I told them I wished to go in such a ship, they generally gave me a chance, if I was pleased with the wages; and if the wages were low and I would not go, I generally got an engagement in some other ship.

14,781. Did you ever get your outfit or supplies from some other agent than the one you engaged with?-No. I never did that, because I found I could have no advantage by it. I have found the system better here than ever I did in the south, because here, if I got my first month's advance, I could get a half-pay ticket along with it; but in the south when I shipped, I got a month's advance, but very seldom a half-pay ticket. In some places I have paid 2s. in the pound, and sometimes 3s. in the pound, for cashing my note; while here the agents don't charge any money for cashing an advance note at all. In Glasgow I have paid 2s., and in the Sailors' Home I have paid 1s. 6d. for that, but here I pay nothing to the agents; at least I have never done it.

14,782. When you take an advance note, do you generally cash it?-Yes, here I do.

14,783. Are you not content to take it out in advances of goods?- If I require it I take it; and if not, I do not. They never asked me to take it in that way. I have come into the office, and I said I wanted my advance note cashed. It is not supposed to be paid until after the ship leaves, but generally the practice with us has been to come down as soon as soon as we have finished signing and ask to get it cashed. Perhaps there is not enough money in the office at the time, and they will give us £1, and say that we will get the rest afterwards. However, I may be willing to take it until I can get it all, and I came back again and get it all.

14,784. When you come down to settle you account at the office, are you usually asked if you want any more goods?-When you come down to settle you account at the office, are you usually asked if you want any more goods?-I was never asked to go and settle my account and to take more goods; but after the money was laid down before me, and I went into the shop to settle any small account I had, they would say, 'Do you want any clothes, Peter?', and I would say 'No;' and there would be no more about it.

14,785. How do you do about the last payment of oil-money? Is it paid at the Custom House?-Generally it is. It has been paid to me for the last two years; but last year it was not, because I was away when it was due. They asked me if I wished to go to the Custom House with it, and I said I did not; that it was all the same to me if I got the money when I cleared the ship's book.

14,786. Have you sometimes had a large sum to get for a last payment of oil-money?-Yes. One year I got about £5 for it from Mr Leask.

14,787. Do you take payment of that when it becomes due, or is it not paid to you usually until you go to get engaged for the next year's voyage?-I have never waited so long for it as the next year's voyage.

14,788. When you get your second payment of oil-money, is it just put into your hand, even although you have been running an account?-Yes. If I have been running an account they lay down the money to me, and then they tell me what my account is, and pay it.

14,789. Do you continue to run an account with the agent after getting your first payment?-Sometimes I do, but very seldom.

14,790. Do you pay in cash at the time for any supplies you get after you have received your first payment?-Yes; whatever I get I pay for them at the time.

14,791. Do you deal in any particular place for them?-Yes; in R. & C. Robertson's.

14,792. You don't deal during winter with the agent who had engaged you for the voyage?-When I have got an engagement through a particular agent, I don't think it is right that I should take the money from him and give it to another; and therefore I get what I want for the voyage from the agent that I getting money from.

14,793. But why do you prefer dealing with R. & C. Robertson in the winter time?-Because Mr. Robertson and I were boys at school together; and when I had a house of my own, he supplied me with goods when I wanted them. That was my only reason for preferring him to any one else.

14,794. But notwithstanding that, you prefer to go to the agent for the supplies you want, when you are on your voyage?-Yes. I have tried it both ways. I have tried taking money out, and buying what I wanted with it, but I did not find that it made any difference.

14,795. Is there not a sort of understanding among seamen who go upon Greenland voyages that they are to take their supplies from the agent who employs them?-I cannot say for anybody but myself. There may be such an understanding, but I cannot say. They may perhaps have asked me if I wanted some small things, and they were there for me if I wanted them; but that was in addition to my first month's advance, and they ran their risk of being paid for them.

14,796. But is there not such an understanding among the men, that they are to get their supplies from the agent who employs them?-Yes, that is the general understanding among the men; but the agent does not bind them in any way to take them. They never did that to me; I don't know what they may have done to others.

14,797. Might the men not stand a chance of not having a good engagement next year if they took their custom elsewhere?-That is wherein the agent loses; [Page 373] at least I don't know if they lose, but they run a chance of losing when the men go off to another agent, because they have then to lie out of their money. If they have made advances to the amount of £3 or £4 to a boy who has only 15s. or 16s. a month, and who will only be out three months on the voyage, they cannot get their money from him then; and perhaps they may never get it, because the boy may go upon a south voyage, and then they lose sight of him. There have been cases of that kind which have come within my own knowledge. I was shipwrecked in 1869, and young lad who was along with me told me he owed 10s. to Mr. Tait. We came back to Shetland again, but he went south two months afterwards, and I don't know if Mr. Tait has been paid yet. The boy has not come back to Shetland again, at any rate.

14,798. But that was not the question I was asking you. What I asked was, if you did not take your custom to the merchant who employed you, would you stand a chance of not getting a good engagement next year?-I have never had any difficulty in that way. I have got an engagement through Mr. Leask, and taken £3, 2s. out of his shop for a voyage of six weeks and a few days; and I came back again next year, and got a ship the same as ever. I went in the same ship again.

14,799. Is there anything more you wish to say?-I went out for Mr. Tait last year. He has resigned the business now to his brother-in-law and another, but I have no doubt I shall go back to the shop and get ship from them; or I could get one from Messrs. Hay the same as ever, if they had any ships this year.

14,800. Have you ever paid a subscription to the Shipwrecked Mariners' Fund?-Yes.

14,801. Have you ever got anything out of it?-Yes, twice; both from Mr. Leask and Mr. Tait.

14,802. Had you much to get?-The first time I had anything to get was after I had been paying in two years, and I got 30s. when I came back.

14,803. What did you lose that year?-I lost different things that I could hardly name.

14,804. Did you get the things replaced?-No.

14,805. Did you get cash for the 30s.?-Yes.

14,806. Was that cash put into your account?-No, I got the money paid down to me.

14,807. Was it paid down in the same way the next time?-Yes. At that time I got it from Mr. Leask. In fact I got it from him before the money was actually payable, because I was going south.

14,808. When was that?-In 1864. I was wrecked in the 'Emma,' and I wished to get south; but I had not money enough, and I went to Mr. Leask, and he advanced it to me.

14,809. How much does your outfit generally cost at the beginning of the year?-I could not exactly say. Some years it will be more, and some less. There are some of the men who have people that make things for them, but others have got nobody to do that, and therefore they have generally more to get from the agents.

14,810. Do you generally lay out £1 or £2 in that way before you start upon your voyage?-Yes; and sometimes £4 or £5.

14,811. Is that an unusual sum?-Yes.

14,812. Who insures the outfit?-The agent generally insures it for his own advantage, so that if the ship is lost he gets his money.

14,813. But they charge the insurance to you?-Yes, they charge the insurance to us if we tell him to insure it. For a good many years I told the agent to insure for me, but I have not lost any ship. When I did lose a ship I have not been charged for it; at least if I was, it was not with my knowledge.

Lerwick, January 29, 1872, Daniel Inkster, examined.

14,814. Are you a seaman living in Lerwick?-Yes. I have been here for the last two years. Before then I lived in the North Isles, on the property which is now in Mr. Walker's hands.

14,815. Have you been at the sealing and whaling for a number of years?-Yes. I have been there for the last fifteen years, but not every year. I was at the ling fishing for about seven years during that time, at Cullivoe, where Mr. Peter Sandison lives.

14,816. Why did you leave Yell?-I was one of Major Cameron's tenants, and I was put away by his factor, Mr. Walker. He offered us leases but of course we knew it was not in our power to take them.

14,817. Why was that?-Because our farms were so small; and when we had to take one-fifth of them for rye-grass, that made them a great deal less. Then the scattald was taken away from us; but we still had to pay our rent, for all that.

14,818. Were you offered a lease?-Yes; but the lease was all on his side, and there was nothing on our side at all.

14,819. When you were in Yell, were you bound to fish for any one?-No. There was no binding at all.

14,820. Where did you get your supplies?-From Mr. Sandison. We always fished for him, and got our supplies from him. I was three years under Mr. Walker. During the first two years I paid my rent, but in the third year we had either to take his lease or go and I knew that I was not able to do it. He said to me that I would have to leave; but I did not know where to go, and I had a family to support. The last year I was on that property I came a little short of my rent, and I wanted him to wait for it until I came down to Lerwick; but he said he was not to wait any longer. He asked me what means I had to give him, and I said I had not much means at all. I said if he chose to take the crop he might do it, but that I would be left to starve afterwards. He took the crop at his own hand, and never put a value upon anything at all; but he told me that if I was not off the ground by such a time he would put me off. He went away to the south at that time, and when Candlemas came round I got a room in Lerwick before he came back. He has done that to a great many more besides me.

14,821. Then you had to leave because you had not paid your rent?-He got the corn and potatoes for the rent.

14,822. But you did not give him money; and if you had paid your rent he would not have taken your crop?-No; but many a proprietor has to wait for month or a couple of months for that, and he sometimes does not get it even then.

14,823. Were you not fishing for Mr. Sandison then?-Yes; but there was a very small fishing that year.

14,824. Had Mr. Sandison paid your rent before?-No; I had paid it.

14,825. You had not been at the whale fishing for several years before that?-No; but I have been for the last two years. I have gone to it since I have been living in Lerwick.

14,826. Whom do you ship with?-For the last two years I have gone out for Mr. Leask.

14,827. Did you require an outfit when you went two years ago?- Yes. I got it from Mr. Leask. It cost about £5.

14,828. What were your wages?-£2, 5s.

14,829. Were you both at the sealing and whaling that year?-Yes; I went both voyages in the same ship.

14,830. Were you due a large account to Mr. Leask at the end of the year?-About £16 or £17.

14,831. Was that for supplies to your family?-Yes.

14,832. Had you any money to get for your voyage?-Yes. I had £12 to get in the first year.

14,833. Had you £28 of earnings for the year?-Yes, for the first and second payments.

14,834. Was that money paid to you at the Custom House?-Yes.

14,835. How much of it?-The whole of it; and then I went down and paid what I was due at the shop after I had been paid off at the Custom House.

14,836. Who went down from the Custom House with you?- There were a good many more than me going [Page 374] down,- men who had been settled with at the same time.

14,837. Did you all go down together to Mr. Leask's?-Yes.

14,838. Who settled with you there?-Mr. Robertson.

14,839. Did you go down with him?-No. One of Mr. Leask's men came up to the Custom House and paid us there, and when we came back Mr. Robertson settled with us at the shop. The person who settled with us at the Custom House was either Andrew Jamieson or John Jamieson, I don't remember which.

14,840. Did he not go down to the shop with you?-No.

14,841. Did he say anything to you about going down to the shop?-No.

14,842. Had you seen Mr. Robertson or any of Mr. Leask's people before you went up to the Custom House?-Yes, one of them told us we had to go there, and that he would be there to settle with us.

14,843. Did he tell you anything else?-He did not tell me anything.

14,844. Had he arranged with you before about meeting him at the Custom House for the settlement?-Yes, either the night before or that morning.

14,845. Had he sent for you to tell you about that?-No; we were waiting there for a settlement.

14,846. Did he tell you at that time how much your account was with Mr. Leask?-Yes.

14,847. And did he tell you that you would have to pay it when you got your money?-Yes.

14,848. Accordingly you did pay it when you got your money, as you had been told?-Yes.

14,849. Did you get an engagement from Mr. Leask in the following year?-Yes.

14,850. Had you an account with him in the same way then, and some money to get at the end of the season?-Yes.

14,851. Were you told in the same way that you would be settled with, and that you would have your account to pay to Mr. Leask after you got your money?-Yes.

14,852. Did you come down from the Custom House with Mr. Jamieson then?-I did not.

14,853. You had been told before that you had to go down to the shop?-Yes.

14,854. And you did go down and pay your money?-Yes.

14,855. Had the rest of the men been told the same thing, that they were to come down and pay their accounts after receiving their money at the Custom House?-Yes, all the men who were in town that day.

14,856. Did you get any of your supplies anywhere else than at Mr. Leask's?-No; not when I was in his employment.

14,857. Why not?-Because I thought I could get my things just as cheap from him as I could get them anywhere else; and another reason was, that if I was short of money I could go and ask him for a supply, or for a little money; whereas if I had gone to any of the small groceries in the town they would not have been able to give me that.

14,858. Where do you get your supplies in the winter time when you are at home?-We generally take couple of bolls of meal from Mr. Leask and pay for them, or get an advance of them if no trade is doing in the town, or if any of us are in bad health.

14,859. Do you sometimes get your supplies elsewhere in winter?-Generally if we have any money, we can buy them at the cheapest market. There is no particular place where we go to.

14,860. Do you sometimes find a cheaper market somewhere else?-No. Mr. Leask can give an article as cheap as anybody in Lerwick can do. There is a Mr. Fraser, a grocer in Lerwick, from whom we got some things in the dead of winter. We take them from him during the week, and pay him on Saturday night for them.

14,861. Are his things as good and cheap as Mr. Leask's?-Just the same. He only charges us the currency.

14,862. Do you employ yourself at any trade during the winter?-I work at anything I have the chance of, when my health permits me. If I get the chance of discharging vessels, or doing a day's work, or anything of that kind, I take it; or sometimes we go to the fishing in a small boat.

14,863. Do you always subscribe to the Shipwrecked Mariners' Fund when you go the whale fishing?-Yes. I have been nineteen years in that Fund.

14,864. Did you ever get anything out of it?-I have got out of it twice. I was cast away in 1863 at Davis Straits, and I had £2, 15s. to get then. I got it in cash from Mr. George Reid Tait. The second time was when I lost a small boat by a storm at sea.

14,865. Were you at the fishing at the time?-No, the boat was secured, but the water came in and took her away. I applied to the agent, and he valued the boat, and sent the money to me.

14,866. Were you running an account with the agent at that time?-No.

14,867. Were you running an account with the agent at the other time when you got money from the Society?-The first time I was. I had an account with Mr. Reid Tait then, and I got the money from him which I had to get from the Society.

14,868. Do you know whether you pay insurance for your outfit when you get one?-I have done so, but not during the last two years.

14,869. Why?-Because I always insured so much on the voyage myself, perhaps upon £7 or £8.

14,870. Why do you do that?-In case the ship is lost, and then of course we get that paid to us until the insurance is taken off.

14,871. Who do you arrange that with?-With the agent who takes out the insurance for us-Mr. Leask or any of the agents. They take 1s. 8d. per £1 for insuring.

14,872. Is that for insuring the ship?-Yes.

14,873. Then it is not the agent's advance to you that is insured?- Perhaps they insure that themselves, but I don't know whether we pay for it or not.

14,874. Is the insurance you have mentioned the only one you pay?-Yes; the only one I pay, to my knowledge.

14,875. Do you get any writing for that insurance?-It has never been asked.

14,876. Has it ever been offered to you?-No; it never was offered that I have been aware of, because we always had to go to the ship and leave here to go south. Therefore I wrote to my wife to go to the merchant about the insurance.

14,877. Do you not join the ship at Lerwick?-Yes; but we are landed in Shetland from the sealing, and the vessel goes south and discharges her oil, and then they send for us to go south and join the ship there. That has been done during the last two years.

14,878. When you get your wife to insure for you, where does she go?-She goes to Mr. Leask.

14,879. Do you not know whether Mr. Leask charges you with an insurance upon your outfit?-No; at least I never was sensible of it.

14,880. Do you not read over your account when you settle it?- Yes, but I never observed that in it.

14,881. Is there no sum for insurance charged in it?-Not to my knowledge; but it may have escaped my notice.

14,882. How does your wife pay for the insurance which you effect?-I pay for it myself at the end of the voyage.

14,883. Who told you about the insurance first?-Mr. Leask or some of his people. I don't know any of them in particular; but of course we have always done it.

Lerwick, January 29, 1872, ARTHUR JOHNSON, examined.

14,884. Are you a tenant and fisherman at Colafirth, near Ollaberry?-I am.

14,885. Do you go to the ling fishing every year?- [Page 375] Yes. I was one year a hired boy, and I have been thirty-three years a sharesman.

14,886. On whose land are you a tenant?-On that of Mr. Gideon Anderson, Ollaberry. It is let on tack to Mr. John Anderson, his brother, and to Mr. John Robertson, Lerwick.

14,887. How do you pay your rent?-We pay our rent at Hillswick to Mr. John Anderson.

14,888. Is that done when you settle for your fish?-We have to go a day or two after we have settled for our fishing, and pay our rent to Mr. Anderson. We get a line from the man we have settled with and go to Mr. Anderson with it, and then he writes us out a receipt for the rent. We do not get the money to give to him at all.

14,889. Do you settle with Mr. William Irvine at Ollaberry?-Yes.

14,890. Are you bound to sell your fish to him?-He is only the factor for Messrs. Anderson & Co. We are bound to sell our fish to them.

14,891. Are you not at liberty to sell your fish to any other person you please?-Not in the summer time. We have not had liberty to do so for the last four years.

14,892. How do you know that?-Because Mr. John Anderson has told us so himself.

14,893. Have you wished to sell your summer fish to any other person?-Yes. If I was at liberty I could have an advantage by it. I have cured my own fish for nineteen years.

14,894. What advantage would you have by doing that?-We sell to more advantage when we are at liberty, but now we get less from Mr. Anderson than we got before for our salt fish, and we get from £1 to 30s. per ton less than he paid to other men who were free men. Last year he paid the free men £22, and he paid me £20, 10s. for salt fish.

14,895. Was it Mr. Irvine who did that?-Yes. He settled according to Mr. Anderson's order. Mr. Irvine is only the factor, and keeps the shop.

14,896. Were you not free to sell your cured fish to any person you pleased?-I did not think it.

14,897. But probably your cured fish were not of such good quality as those which brought £22?-I would put my character for having good fish against that of any man, because we attended to the curing of our fish ourselves. We only had a boy for washing, but we split and cured them ourselves, and we paid them all the attention we could. I know that the quality was good, because those who knew good fish told us so and I also knew it myself.

14,898. But when you got £20, 10s. offered to you, why did you not take your fish to another market if you thought you could get a better price for them?-It was not in my power then, because the fish were in Leith; they had been shipped there.

14,899. Did you deliver your dried fish without knowing what price you were to get for them?-Yes.

14,900. Why did you do that?-We must do it. We had no cellars of our own, and we had to put them into Mr. Anderson's cellar.

14,901. Why did you not get the price fixed before you delivered them?-Because that is not the practice. When we deliver our fish, they tell us they don't know the price.

14,902. Did you not see the bills of sale after the fish were sold in Leith?-No, I never see them.

14,903. Might you not have seen them if you had asked for it?-I never asked for it.

14,904. Then you have no reason to believe that you got less for your fish than they actually brought when sold in Leith?-I cannot say what the Leith price was.

14,905. But you could have seen the bills of sale if you had asked for them?-I do not think I would have been allowed to see the bills of sale.

14,906. You cannot be sure of that unless you had asked for them?-No, I cannot be sure of that; but I don't believe they would have been shown to me.

14,907. Why did you not ask for them?-I don't know.

14,908. Were you afraid to do that?-No, I was not afraid; but it did not occur to me to do so. I know that last year I was stopped from selling my fish, and free men were paid 8s. 6d., while I was only paid 8s. for them.

14,909. Was that for your green fish?-Yes.

14,910. Then what fish were you selling dry?-Ling, tusk, and cod.

14,911. Were these your winter fish?-No, they were the summer fish.

14,912. But I thought you were bound to deliver your fish green to Mr. Anderson?-No. We had been in the practice of salting them before we delivered them, and we continued to do so until last year; but he stopped us from salting them then.

14,913. I thought you said you had been bound for four years?- Yes. It is four years since we were bound to fish for him regularly; he got the tack then.

14,914. Have you been fishing for Mr. Anderson for these four years?-Yes; three years we delivered the fish to him salt, and one year green.

14,915. Then all you were bound to do was to deliver your fish to him, either salt or green?-Yes.

14,916. You could cure them or not, as you liked?-Yes, for the first three years; but this year he would not allow us to cure them.

14,917. Was that because the quality of your cured fish was not good?-The fish were good.

14,918. Did he not assign that to you as the reason?-No. When I was told not to salt the fish last season, I went to him and asked him if that was on account of bad fish, and he said, No, he could not say that it was.

14,919. Did he give you any reason for not allowing you to continue to cure your own fish?-Very little.

14,920. Did he give any reason at all?-He said that other fishermen in the neighbourhood were thinking that they might be allowed to cure their fish as well.

14,921. Do you think fishermen generally can cure their own fish as well as when they are cured by a factor who gives his whole time to it?-I think so, provided they would pay a little attention to it themselves.

14,922. Do you get your supplies at the shop at Ollaberry?-Yes; or from Mr. Anderson's factor at the fishing station at Hamnavoe.